My Naltrexone Journey

[brightlite]

If you are talking about side effects, the Topo "Dopo" effects were much worse for me. I was on the Nal for about a week, but decided that it did not have any effect on me. Impatient I guess, anyway I am considering giving it another try with the understanding that I may be one of the ones that does not experience any effect right away.

Also, after continued reading and research, I'm very interested in the Nal and Bac combination as Loop is currently taking. To me it seems to address all the issues and works in combination on different neurotransmitters for a more effective approach. Throw in some real will power and support and it might be the answer for me.

[lenaleed]

brightlite -- No one experiences any meaningful effect from naltrexone "right away." It is not an anti-craving med. What it does is dismantle the neural pathways that reinforce the learned behavior of excess alcohol consumption. This happens over several weeks or months of drinking sessions, and it cannot consciously be felt. You might want to read Eskapa's book. It costs only about twelve bucks and is not one of those infomercial-in-a-book deals (like the Enterhealth people of Passages Malibu, both of which are books to sell pricey rehab). There are chapters posted on thesinclairmethod.com along with lots of other information about naltrexone.

NO study has demonstrated the efficacy of naltrexone as an anti-craving med. There is the anecdotal exception, of course; a few here have reported it works that way for them (or at least did for a time) and I must respect that.

I certainly can see why the naltrexone/baclofen combination has appeal. Some over at the TSM board are adding baclofen to their regimen, or considering it. For those who are drinking at dangerously high levels or for other reasons can't wait the weeks or months it takes for naltrexone to work, the two could be an ideal solution.

All good wishes for success in whatever you decide.

[NC]

I have been taking bac for eight weeks and nal for four weeks. I started nal in case I could not continue to take bac because of somnolence. I am tolerating the somnolence and I now am almost AF from the bac. As stated previously, I am considering continuing the nal while drinking one or two glasses of wine a night to see if after several months of that regimen I can taper down the bac to nothing and just continue the nal whenever I want to have a drink. I know bac is considered safe to take long term, but it just seems it would be easier and better to take nal on a prn basis.

So using bac to become AF early on and then continuing nal to see if it can be the long term solution.
I have posted this question on the TSM site to Dr. Eskapa and hope to see what he thinks.

Any opinions from you all? I know LoOP has told me he is sort of doing the same thing. The problem I think I might have is that I am becoming so happy with the bac that it might be hard to force myself to have a glass of wine a night.

Thanks.

NC

[Cinders]

Combination of Naltrexone and Baclofen for Alcohol Dependence:A Pilot Study. - Full Text View - ClinicalTrials.gov

Cindi

[NC]

Cindi,
Thanks. I am aware of that study as well as other studies by Dr. Garbutt. It should be noted that the maximum dose of baclofen is only 30 mg per day and the study is for 12 weeks only. So, it seems that the bac dose is low with respect to what others are finding effective for them on this forum, and the length of the study is short with respect to the TSM regimen. It will be interesting so see what his findings are.

Again, thanks.

I have posted on the TSM forums, subject "Naltrexone and Baclofen" and had responses from Virgil, Lena, and bob 3d. Also had response from LoOP on this forum with respect to using bac and nal. Any new ideas or other opinions would be appreciated.

NC

[boozer]

Hi brightlite,Lenaleed NC and Cinders,Thanks so much for your posts. I have been taking 50mg Nal everyday for about 4 weeks now and it has had no effect.I drink about 1 to 1.5 bottles of wine a day .I take the drug 1 hr at 4.30pm prior to drinking. Am I expecting to much to soon ? I have read that it can take weeks even months for the drug to start doing its job in blocking receptors and the craving to drink. Can you give me any advice? I don't want to give up and really need support at the moment.

[crown86]

Well guys and Gals this the week ending January 3rd.

I have not kept track of my units. I am going to start again this week but I am starting to feel that the units are of no value to me. I really wanted to tame or quit Alcohol for these reasons:

1. I wanted to no longer hurt those close to me. Since TSM I have not had one alcohol related fight or craziness or bizzare incedent. Which Pre-TSM they were every week.

2. I wanted the depression that only alcohol can cause to disappear from my life so I could begin to rebuild. I still have depression no doubt. But it is not a crazy suicidal why I am breathing depression. It is manageable and again I feel like I can fuction enough to rebuild my life and am begining to see myself as worthwhile again.

For me this holiday season has been pure hell. I am so glad it's over. But I know this for a god given fact - if it wasn't for tsm I would have been drunk every day and night from right before Christmas until now. I broke up with my fiance still crying the blues over it, money is tight, and I have isolated myself from people. I am going to fix the money problem this week and resume my career in a big way or at least go down swinging, I am going to be spending a lot of time in the city around people and friends so I will squash the isolationism. As far as the fiance I am not trying to sound cold it hurts like hell but i am not in highschool so it's not the first broken heart and without booze at crazy levels its tolerable at best right now. The only cure for a broken heart I know of is time and without alcohol time can pass and heal me.

As far as actual units go I drank just about everyday this past week and the whole holiday season. Had friends from the city come between Xmas and new years and for new Years went to Family's house. Hell this is the first new Years I went to bed sober in I don't know how many years and did not have that hangover new years day thing going on. I actually enjoyed and remebered visting with my Family and did not make a fool out of myself. The units are still as far as I am concerned low - average around five per day and one AF day so that would be 30 for the week.

I am still not where I want to be with alcohol I would like lower consumption but I am PLEASED with my results so far. Straight hard liquor continues to make me sick and I am primarialy drinking beer which in the past I hated for the fact it couldn't get me where I wanted to be buzz wise. Beer is fine and all but not CLOSE to a whiskey buzz. I still crave the whiskey buzz but the thought of the mechanic of getting the buzz makes me sick. I never in a million years thought a pill could make me lose my desire for whiskey. I LOVE THE TASTE I LOVE THE BUZZ I LOVE THE ROMANTICISM IN MUSIC OVER WHISKEY. Hence I loved everything about it. Now I love the buzz but cant bear the thought of getting there to the point I pass on it. I have never had a half gallon of whiskey last so long in my house since I can't remember it has made it from kitchen counter to the liquor cabinet.

I am now playing the "I will only drink beer game" and sticking to it with ease and by choice effortlesly.Drinking no more than five which Pre-TSM I could knock back easily 15 or more if it's just beer. So this week hard liquor continues to make me ill, and my tolerance remains obliterated and I'm happy for this. I am positively convinced I am drinking out of habit because when things are bad thats what I do I drink. I am not happy about this and I know I need to re-learn healthy coping mechanisms but for now I am pleased. I look at it like i did not destroy myself overnight I can not fix myself overnight.

I feel for all of you that TSM is not working for. I pray that either it will begin to work or you will find another method or a combination of TSM and something else that does work. Your posts I apprciate as much those "cured" It makes me that much more greatful and figure "there but the grace of God go I"

[crown86]

Week 7 ending Jan 10th 2010
Guestimated units mabey 15ish

Pretty uneventful week as far as alcohol goes...LOL and that is a damn miracle..I can't beleive I am writing this..As far as units..again a guestimate as I have not been keeping track. I have almost exlusively drank beer out of choice not my old bs moderation game. Hard liquor is still repulsing me physically but not mentally..wish it would mentally..would have saved me from the porcilan throne thursday evening.

Was over at a friends on thursday night with a few people..the karoke machine got drug out...LOL..I play guitar and love music..so..I slammed six beers pretty fast...like in an hour and a half...man I was wasted. Then the shots came out...I did two...the second one sent me running to the bathroom. No wacky behavior though from me - was in control buzz wise.

The best part alcohol wise about this night - I have not been drunk on a six pack since college and the shots were like in the begining of my drinking career...LOL man up with the boys and have shot..if your mouth starts watering and your stomach rumbles NEVER LET'M SEE YA SWEAT. I am very pleased with this night, was like I had the tolerance when I was 27ish at the begining of my booze love affair. On 6 beers and 2 shots I puked and the night was fuzzy and the next day was hell. I cant remember the last time I had a hangover like this. Take the day off get a steak and cheese close the blinds and watch old John Wayne Movies all day and swear I will never do it again. During the height of my alcoholism hangovers didn't happen - feeling like crap became a way of life.

I am still amazed at myself with the shot thing. Hard liquor has been making me ill lately. I took these shots like the pre-alcoholic drinking, just to be macho with the boys, only difference I was thinking and HOPING and PRAYING I would get sick, just to know TSM is working. I could have passed with minimal effort...ah but the macho thing, the romanticism of whiskey got me. To me mental not physical...need to kill this. I am done puking and very much am sure I will pass in the future.

During my drinking madness when I still went to bars I didn't give damn who had shot, I was drinking them on the side with Crown on the rocks as my main course. I was way past the every guy out with us gets a shot gather in a circle make some stupid toast and drink'm. I didn't need company for them and my buddies were always like damn how many of those you gonna drink. I used to take my thumb and index finger and form a C and tell the bartender "C is for champ, give me another little one". I feel like it's a full circle right back to the begining almost.

Rest of the week was a beer here and there with dinner type thing. If this week could be the rest of my life drinking I would be completely satisfied.

[bernard]

Originally Posted by Cinders

Combination of Naltrexone and Baclofen for Alcohol Dependence:A Pilot Study. - Full Text View - ClinicalTrials.gov

Garbutt is running this study. He is rabidly anti-baclofen because of his flaming jealousy of Ameisen for being charming and handsome, having a beautiful French accent, and being credited for curing alcoholism -- all things that Garbutt wished for himself, and thought that he rightly deserved.

Watch for the baclofen dose to be 30 mg, and Garbutt to announce that it has no effect.

[brightlite]

Crown,

Awesome posts. I know that you are struggling, as we all are. I enjoy reading your posts because they are so real. You lay it all out and think your thoughts as you write. Keep it up. Always be vigilant of the demon and never give up.


Bernard,
I'm pretty sure you will be right about this Garbutt character! That's too bad when jealousy affects the research. He probably is doing it to try to prove Ameisen wrong or discredit him.