Nal and Wine Drinkers

[brightlite]

I have read recently that Nal may not be as effective on wine drinkers. I would like to know if anyone has more information on this or the reasons why this may be likely.

[eight days a week]

Hi brightlite, I posted this on my thread, but just to make sure you see it this is a topic that greatly interests Virgil and others, I'm sure he'll contribute when he can

[scot98]

Hi Brightlite,

I drink red wine pretty much solely, started on Nal just over a week ago and over the past week my consumption has dropped by roughly a third. I have been taking 25mg due to side effects but have taken 50 tonight, will see how it goes.
I realise it is very early to get hopeful but nevertheless I am really hoping this kicks my wine drinking into touch.

Best wishes

Oh and I am not sure why nal would be any less effective on wine as opposed to vodka, whisky etc.....after all ethanol is what alcohol is regardless of the type of drink. Not that i am an expert on ethanol, other than having drank plenty over the years!

[eight days a week]

I think the debate is something to do with the extra concentration of GHB in wine as opposed to other drinks.

I was chatting privately to another member just yesterday about this. I can't remember as it's so long since I read it, but I seem to recall that there is talk of the effect of GHB in certain types of alcoholics in Dr Ameisen's book.

I may be wrong on all fronts, and stand ready to be corrected.

<edit> I and the other member discussed, but couldn't between us make up our mind, if Dr Ameisen had said that alcohol, GHB, and Baclofen are the only substances that act on the Gaba-b receptors in the brain. From Wikipedia (yes, not always the best source of info!): 'GABAB receptors are involved in behavioral actions of ethanol,[3] gamma-Hydroxybutyric acid (GHB),[4] and possibly in pain'.

Nal works on the opioid receptors, a completely different action. On another forum some members discussed whether there were primarily 'endorphin' drinkers and likewise 'Gaba' drinkers. I personally think I'm a mix. There seemed to be anecdotal evidence that Nal was less successful for wine drinkers, but then out of all the membership of that forum I personally don't think enough people have been 'cured' to be able to draw any sort of conclusions.

I'm sure someone with more knowledge and understanding of the situation will chip in soon

[brightlite]

Thanks for the information and I hope to see more posts about this. I understand that Nal can take a long time to eradicate the drinking pattern. I've only been on Nal for 1 1/2 months. The first couple times of drinking a bottle of wine (my usual amount) the next morning I was nauseous. Now, I don't feel anything. Well I shouldn't say that....after taking the pill and waiting 1 hour, there is a definite feeling, hard to describe...not floaty or light headed, but a difference that I can feel.

Anyway, just seeing Crown's success and understanding that he was primarily a Scotch, Whiskey and Beer drinker, made me wonder why I don't feel any reduction as of yet.

[eight days a week]

It's too soon, far too soon, to expect any feeling of reduction brightlite. Crown and one other person are the only ones from perhaps hundreds I've read about who have been cured in under the time-span outlined in the book. And the real-life 'cured' mostly seem to take longer!

Personally I think it's a very positive sign that you got those initial feelings and still notice a slight difference, even if you're not drinking less yet. Good signs, so just patience is all else you need

[brightlite]

Thanks for the words of encouragement Eight...I know that Crown is the exception and also I know there are others that have taken it for a year without a reduction. There has to be an explanation for that.

How are you doing with your Bac...are you going to try to reduce your intake?

[eight days a week]

Originally Posted by brightlite

Thanks for the words of encouragement Eight...I know that Crown is the exception and also I know there are others that have taken it for a year without a reduction. There has to be an explanation for that.

How are you doing with your Bac...are you going to try to reduce your intake?

You're most welcome my friend. Crown is not just an exception, he's a miracle under TSM!! Personally I think a year is too long without seeing any benefit, though I admire those folks' determination and perseverance. The explanation could well be that they are in the percentage that were reported in the clinical studies as unresponsive to Nal. The wine thing may or may not be a red herring, but as I say I'll let others who know more about that hopefully chime in. GHB does seem to me to be perhaps mixed up in there somewhere for certain drinkers...I think for me it is, and I never drink wine!

I've written about my Bac thoughts on my progress thread, as per usual in my wordy style, so I won't comment on that here.

Looking forward to reading more about wine and Bac from those in the know

[Virgil]

Originally Posted by eight days a week

Hi brightlite, I posted this on my thread, but just to make sure you see it this is a topic that greatly interests Virgil and others, I'm sure he'll contribute when he can

Yes, 8 is spot-on. I am indeed very interested in the special properties of wine over other alcoholic drinks. To this end, I recently posted on the following thread:

I want a Glass of Wine!!!

When I discovered this information, I felt that I had stumbled across a real gem. I hope others will also find this interesting.

V.

[eight days a week]

Interesting V. Have you read the Wikipedia page on GHB? As well as references to Baclofen, it suggests that GHB is found in both beers and wine, but in small quantities, which seems to go against Dr Ameisen's research.

Now, I'm the last person to take advice from Wikipedia alone! But it did cite a study, have you read it?

'GHB is also produced as a result of fermentation and so is found in small quantities in some beers and wines, in particular fruit wines. However, the amount of GHB found in wine is insignificant and not sufficient to produce any effects.[46]'

The citation:

^ Elliott S, Burgess V. "The presence of gamma-hydroxybutyric acid (GHB) and gamma-butyrolactone (GBL) in alcoholic and non-alcoholic beverages". Forensic Science International. 2005 July 16;151(2–3):289–92.