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**Guest** · November 20, 2005, 12:11 AM

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I'd advise you to read through this website. I think you are a pretty good candidate for the program. You are drinking very similarly to how I was...and I could go through wine pretty quickly and with little effect.

First, the topamax will make you dopey for awhile while you adjust, but now that I am adjusted I am OK. I think topamax is much more refined than, say, the medication the dog you have is on. Second, I think you need to reset your tolerance level and work the program a bit. I hope that you would do the full program and not plan on drinking bottles of wine at night just because they're free and an occupational hazard. Also, just like many of us, try to abstain for awhile at the beginning of the program. (Even if you really HAVE to for your job..it's not more than a swallow or two in most of the time) It's good to learn how to live without it for some time.

Good to have you on board.

It's nice to be on the full topamax level though. It's great to go out and have a nice bottle of wine with someone and really savor it. It's fantastic.

Jen

**Guest** · November 20, 2005, 08:37 AM

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Hello and welcome. As Jen says you sound like a great candidate for MWO. Virtually all of the wine-drinking sorts of us on this board?and that is nearly all of us, with a few exceptions?can relate to being able to put down a bottle (or more) of wine and barely feeling a thing. And as you have already realized by coming to this board, the amount of wine you will consume will likely only grow with time, as it will take more and more to feel any effect at all.

As a chef and sommelier (the latter more by avocation than vocation) I too am professionally required to taste alcohol both in cooking as well as in working with sommeliers in pairings. I love doing pairings?finding the ?perfect? match (and I like to search out the unique ones) is really such a gastronomic adventure. That coupled with the fact that I just love the taste of fine wine made the thought of quitting drinking all together rather depressing. But I knew I had a terrible problem and it would probably kill me if I didn?t get it under control. I?m a bit older than you (45) and so had a few more years of abuse to realize just how much I had compromised my health because of my drinking.

Luckily I had just returned to NY from a job working at a luxury resort our west when I made the decision to quit, so was not working at the time. This meant I would not be exposed to alcohol on a daily basis. For this I was thankful, for as Jen points out most everyone on this board would agree if you are hoping for moderation with this program a period of abstinence is strongly recommended when you first begin. And even as a sommelier abstinence is possible, at least for a period of time. It?s rare that you?d need to taste wine as part of the nightly recommendation process, and tastings can easily be handled with spitting.

I understand your trepidation about Topamax. I?m not really a pill person myself but felt my health and well-being were too important, and I so I just told myself to ?get over it? and try it as part of my recovery. I?m very glad I did. For as part of the overall MWO program I feel it was a key element in allowing me to begin to have what I consider to be a much healthier relationship with alcohol. Note that I did not say ?healthy? relationship with alcohol. That I can never have, for as a recovering problem drinker I will never be able to have a healthy relationship with alcohol. For me, it?s just not possible.

The side effects of Topamax are quite individual. Jen commented she experienced a little of what is affectionately referred to as the ?TopaDopa? effect. This is the dopiness you referred to and are concerned about. Others have also mentioned they have had similar experiences. It is usually manifested by interchanging words, difficulty finding the right words and things of that nature. I had a version of it, but mine was limited to written communications only. There are other side effects as well that can include things such as tingling of the extremities, sleepiness and loss of appetite. The good news is the side effects for most people are mild and short lived. So as Jen says, Topamax does sound like a much more sophisticated drug than what your dog is taking.

As your bulletin board name implies, you need to think about whether you?re ready to make the commitment to this program. I think Jen?s advice to read through the posts on this board is great. There?s a lot of great wisdom here from all walks of life. Some of it you?ll relate to, some of it you won?t. Whatever you decide, best of luck in your journey.

Amy

**Guest** · November 20, 2005, 06:45 PM

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scared

Hi Thank you both for your replies, they have been very helpful. my fears are still very present about the drugs, do people have success without them, and just with the supplements?

Also I have read through some of the replies and I have noticed that there are a few people from Canada on here, is the prescription hard to get here, do you have to order it from the states?

I was feeling so much more excited yesterday. Today I am scared and don't want to stop drinking wine, it is such a comfort...yet I know I have to. How do you get past the fear and just do it?????

**Guest** · November 20, 2005, 08:39 PM

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Re: scared

Taking medication on this program is a purely personal choice. There are many people who do not. I chose to take Topamax as I wished to pursue a lifestyle that would allow moderate drinking and felt I would not be able to accomplish this without the aid of this medication. I am not a person who believes in ?never say never? but I think it would be a rare person indeed who has a drinking problem that would be able to successfully achieve moderate drinking without the aid of a medication like Topamax. I?m sure they exist, but I know I would never be one of them.

The supplements are fantastic because they are designed to support a whole host of issues associated with problem drinking. Some, like All One, helps replace all of the vitamins, minerals and amino acids problem drinking robs from your body. This disease is not only unkind to your liver, but to your entire immune system. The nutritional supplements are meant to help correct these imbalances. Kudzu and l-glutamine and the two cornerstone anti-craving supplements of the program. It really is quite unbelievable how effective both are in bringing almost instantaneous relief. Interspersed throughout this board you?ll find all sorts of clever insights on how people have used them to stop cravings.

The other aspects of the program?the hypnotic CDs, diet and exercise?are also quite key, in my mind, to making the program work. There is nothing like sweating your way through a craving and building muscle as an added side benefit.

If you do choose to go on Topamax you?ll find that Canadian doctors, like US doctors, are a pretty conservative lot about prescribing it. Its use for treating alcohol dependency is considered off-label and so it does generally take some convincing. If you opt to go this route, many of us here can offer you some advice on the best way to approach your doctor. We?ve seen just about every objection there is to see.

As for getting past the fear?that?s the hardest part, and it comes for everybody a little differently. But I know exactly what you mean when you say you don?t want to give wine up because it?s such a comfort, and it is. Alcohol is a best friend. It was a best friend for all of us. And it?s very difficult to turn your back on something like that. I know. But like you, I also knew I had to do it, and so despite the fact that it was a best friend, I just did it. Without really wanting to do it per se, and with the fear of giving it up still there, I just did it.

And then something began to happen?I slowly no longer missed my ?best friend.? In fact, I began to question how I could have been so foolish to have spent so many years putting off quitting when it felt this good to be sober. Don?t misunderstand me, it wasn?t easy to quit?it was very hard, and is still difficult at times; sobriety is a fragile thing. But the clarity of mind, the freedom from the addiction, the lack of obsession, and the beauty to just be able to live my life without thinking about alcohol is a joyous thing. If I could bottle this feeling and give it to problem drinkers, I think it would be easier for a lot of people to quit.

You?ll know when your time is right. You?ll just do it. Because you?ll know you have to.

Amy

**Guest** · November 21, 2005, 03:39 PM

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OFF SHORE HELP

Hello gang,
I am glad to find you. I need support in a big bad way! I am new to the site. Have read the book and have been taking all the suppliments for four days. I have ordered the c.d.'s and waiting for them.
I did go to the doctor but she refused the topamax. Gave me paxil instead. I don't feel anxiety I feel cravings!!!
I am o.k. all day, but on the drive home from work I start to crave a drink and pull into the wine tasting store...for just a sip, which turns into buying a bottle or two.
The suppliments make me feel better but I am still drinking about 4-6 glasses a night. That's cut way down in four days but I think I need the topamax.
How do I find the offshore contections and how do I know I am getting what I think in the pill? Also I am concerned that I am a public speaker. It sounds to me from the book that speech is a problem with the topamax. I've read through the message boards about some of your experiences. How long to the Topodopa systems last? And are there any others out there who have to talk in public a lot and are on the drug. I have a week off work coming up soon. Would that be enough time to get through the crazy part?
Finally, there is a suppliment that RJ mentioned that helped with her thinking.... I don't have the book with me but if you know what I am talking about-----did it help any of you and do you know where to get it?
I really want to make this work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

**Guest** · December 4, 2005, 02:25 PM

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Re: OFF SHORE HELP

I think there is a little too much made of the topa dopa thing or has someone out there had it really bad? It nearly put me off taking it because i thought I would be snoring in work and drooling at the mouth on this drug. The only thing it does is give me 2-3 mins of nausea when i stand out of bed in the morning.It passes when I move around. I was as irritable as hell for about three weeks when i started you know that bad pmt feeling? but that could have been withdrawal and i didnt have all supps either so not fair really to call that a topa side effect but even if it was it passed. The topa dopa effect for me was just like a state of relaxation and if you take it after 6.00pm thats ok isnt it? Anyway i used united pharmacies to order my drugs.They arrived in double quick time and nothing bad has happened my credit card details. Oh and i am still alive after taking the drug. They were three big three fears of mine. Good luck!

**Guest** · December 7, 2005, 02:08 PM

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Re: scared

I am scared to stop drinking wine too! It is my best friend! I notice you posted this a few weeks ago... any decisions since then? I have not started as of today, but plan to start ASAP when I have all of the "materials." I have read the book and LOVED it! Have you? L

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