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    Should I Mod or Abstain???

    This is an open letter, an answer to an inquiry I received.
    The question, basically: "Should I Mod or Abstain?"

    The identity problem; Modder vs. Abstainer
    You know, of course this is the one thing you have to decide for yourself.
    I can tell you how it was for me; but I can't decide for YOU

    I didn't know what to call myself before coming to MWO.
    I was a self-made Modder.
    I thought I was alone in my pursuit until a friend introduced me to MWO
    where I found others also pursuing a moderated alcohol intake lifestyle.
    I have no plans to ever abstain permanently at this point in time.
    I'm adamant...
    I'm SO glad to be a Modder that I could just jump up and down, laughing and yelling.
    It is one of the best things I've ever done for myself.
    My motto is : "The Mod Life is the Good Life"
    Now I know that whatever life has to offer, I can partake of it, taste it, try it...
    just NEVER overdo it!
    I love how I feel when I'm AF; but I enjoy my drink.

    I tried Abs for almost a year. I KNEW it wasn't right. I was sad. I hated it.
    I felt like a child; like a person with a deficit.
    I hated that my lack of self control had brought me to the point where I had to abstain from something that had added,
    what to me was, some richness and romance to my life.
    (It brought plenty of bad things too, don't get me wrong; but that was MY fault, not the alcohol's)
    While abstaining, I would occasionally obsess too; "White-knuckling"...
    When I slipped, I would binge.
    I knew that come tomorrow, or a couple of days, or whenever, I would have to commit to abstaining for life again;
    so I would "make the most of it", and binge.
    For a number of reasons, I just decided one day that I was going to conquer this, and learn to moderate.

    Now, with moderation, everyone has to find where it works.
    Everyone has different rules. I'm OK with that.
    I tried and failed at different approaches; but I wasn't going back to abstaining.
    A failure at successful Modding just meant I wasn't doing it right;
    it didn't mean I couldn't ultimately moderate my intake.
    I had used REBT tools and the SMART system to change my behaviors so I could abstain.
    I used the same thought processes and tools to cut down on my intake.
    They didn't like that at SMART.
    They banned me.

    Think about this:
    WHATEVER IT TOOK TO HELP YOU DRINK ZERO DRINKS PER DAY
    CAN BE USED TO HELP YOU DRINK ONE DRINK PER DAY...
    Is that not the simplest concept EVER???

    My wife loves that I mod. This is reliable; this is something I can do forever.
    There were times when I was abstaining (trying to be something I wasn't) that I would binge.
    She never knew when this might happen.
    She knows I won't binge now.
    I may go over my preferred limit now and then, but bells and whistles are going off;
    and by "practicing", by doing AF days, EVERY WEEK,
    I'm gaining the strength to stop before I get carried away.

    I have heard the discussion about how many days to abstain before trying to Mod;
    14 days, 30 days, 90 days...it doesn't matter.
    I believe a person should abstain long enough to prove they have some control.
    They should obviously abstain long enough to get the alcohol and its byproducts out of the system;
    breaking the physical and most of the psychological addiction.

    After that I believe one should never drink more than 2 or 3 days in a row.
    It takes 3 days to grossly detox the system
    and I think that third day of drinking begins an addictive cycle that is harder to break.
    If you drink 3 days; you will want to drink a fourth day, etc...

    I believe one should not drink more than 2 drinks on the drinking day.
    That third drink numbs the frontal lobe and makes us think we are less drunk than we actually are.
    Numbing the frontal lobe also inhibits impulse control and sets one up for "stupid behavior".
    Then of course, there's the next day...

    These are some of my thoughts to get your own thinking started.
    Write if you have more questions...
    And remember: "Sobriety" and "abstinence" are not synonymous.

    ~Kid Shelleen~
    It is not how much we have, but how much we enjoy, that brings us happiness.
    ~ Charles Spurgeon

    #2
    Should I Mod or Abstain???

    Hi Kid,
    Well, this is seems as though it was written for me!!!
    This has been an ongoing question for me. Since coming to MWO, I've gone back and forth, making decisions to quit, talking to folks about modding vs. abstaining, trying to figure myself out. So many of your comments hit home for me and I'd like post my comments.

    First, though, I feel as though I need to clarify some things about myself. Before coming to MWO, I was new to any ideas of AF life and the modding life. The wealth of information I've gotten here has made some positive permanent changes in my life and I'm so grateful to the people here for that. Your encouragement and care is just so beyond what I'd ever imagine I'd receive. I know I haven't reciprocated on a consistent basis, but I've tried, and I'll continue to make MWO a part of my life. Permanent changes require permanent commitment.

    After being AF for over two months, I decided to write up a plan for modding. It was a comprehensive plan, detailed, because that's how my mind works. It worked well for 1 1/2 months. When December came, I kind of blew, breaking rules here and there, but never really getting back into the depths of alcohol madness I've experienced before. I've got chronic depression which peaks at this time of the year, every year for as long as I can remember.

    After the holidays, I went AF again, because I made a commitment to do so. When I started my sabbatical (haven't been without work for 17 years) I became anxious about not drinking as I was going away. I drank. Now I'm commited again for as long as I can be. I can't make a promise like I have before to myself or to others about not drinking anymore. Possibly I'm in denial about myself. Very good chance. I know that drinking has taken it's toll on my mind, body, and spirit. I've done so much to make changes and I've been successful.

    It becomes easier and easier to abstain for long periods of time for me. A while back, I couldn't even fathom a week without al. Now, my habits have changed so much. It's enjoyale to sit at home on a Friday night and watch 20/20 with my husband while my son is out at a dance. Before, I'd have to have a bottle of wine to enjoy the night. I love waking up with a clear head and energy for the day. These are some of the best reasons to not drink. I'm getting used to this and like I said, it's becoming more of a habit and way of life for me.

    But then there is a part of me that can't let it idea go that if I want to go out with my husband for a nice dinner, I'm going to want wine to be a part of the evening. Or if I go to some celebration of any sort, I'll want to have some drinks.

    I believe deep down there are many reasons for why my drinking became habitual and addictive for me. At this time, I'm in therapy for these issues that are being worked out. It feels so good to be discovering the real me. I'm also doing things for myself during this time off that I haven't been able to do. My anxiety has always been through the roof, and I'm in a program that is helping that. So, so many things I was unable to take care of before, I am. It feels good to take care of myself.

    I'm sure I have the "gene" that makes one an alcoholic. But with my determination, I also believe there is a way to control this. I don't believe I can be a weekly modder, having an af day here or there, then having drinks a few days a week. I think that would lead me down the wrong road. I believe for myself, I've got to stay AF as much as possible in life.


    Kid, when you said you felt like a child or a person with a deficit when you abstained, I can relate to that. The obsessions are there for me too, and I'm sure they lessen as they have for me when I decide to abstain. I think the risks of binging are so much greater for me when I think I'm going to live a complete AL free life. I get so down with myself thinking I deserve nothing.

    I failed at my first moderation attempt - when I had a complete plan. Prior to that, I failed with unwritten rules for myself - I'd given myself no direction. This may be wrong, but I'm going to stay AF for as long as I can, but I won't make a promise never to drink again. If I drink, I'll make another commitment to stay af again.

    I have so many tools now because of coming here. So much more strength than I'd had before. I've come a long way and intend to become even stronger and better.

    Chief, if you're reading this, I know what you're thinking. I hope I haven't lost your friendship over this. I'm being as strong as I can be at this time in my life. And anyone else that thinks I'm full of shi** you have every right to your opinions. I just know that I've come a long way, much farther than I'd ever imagined, with the help of all of you and this site.

    Thanks, Kid, for posing this questions.
    Sometimes what you're most afraid of doing is the very thing that will set you free.

    Comment


      #3
      Should I Mod or Abstain???

      J-Vo, I am damned proud of you!! Just reading your post, much of which I agree with and can relate to tells me that you are approaching this with all the dedication and commitment your sobriety deserves. I support you 100%, but you know that.
      "The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it"

      Comment


        #4
        Should I Mod or Abstain???

        Thanks Deebee! Jeez, I miss talking to you. I hope you're doing well. I've caught a little here and there with your smoking goals. I hope you're finding your way out with that. As for me, that's something I'll work towards also, but not just yet. One thing at a time, one day at a time!
        Sometimes what you're most afraid of doing is the very thing that will set you free.

        Comment


          #5
          Should I Mod or Abstain???

          Kid,
          Thanks for the new thread. I like this one and I'm going to share the cake analogy with you.

          Moderating alcohol is equivalent to someone watching their diet and choosing to control the portions of food they take in. I love the weight watchers concept because you can eat anything as long as you monitor how much you are taking in versus activity and calories you are burning.

          So, they never tell you that you can't eat cake. Because if they did it may be too easy to obsess about cake because you know you can't have it. But if you said or thought "NO thanks I'm avoiding sweets, I'll only have a sliver of a slice" and you tasted it and enjoyed every slow bite you wouldn't feel deprived and you probably wouldn't obsess about it. So to me, modding can work for some because they're not going around thinking ... "I can NEVER have a drink again."

          Through moderating I have learned that I have to monitor and control how much I drink when I start. And it really has made me become so much more aware of what I am doing. The few times I've gone over my limit I am still very aware that I am doing that and am also more acutely aware of how much others are drinking around me.

          When I drank too much before moderating I drank with wild abandon. I'd go to a party and drink one wine after another without thinking about it. And then w-h-a-m it would hit me like a mack truck. I could go from conversing normally to slurring my words and stumbling in a second! Amazed friends witnessed it and were astounded how I would apparently be horribly drunk in a heartbeat.

          So far the mod life is working for me but I realize it can't for everyone as some do find that they can't stop at the 2 or 3 they limited themselves to and have to make a choice for their safety to be AF. And because I have found myself on a few occasions not stopping at my limit (but not getting as bad as I used to) I consider myself still struggling with the modding concept and hoping it can work for me or I may be shooting over to the other board as well!

          Great thread - thanks Kid. Hope it helped J-Vo as I know you've been struggling with this one sister.

          Hugs,
          Eve11
          "Control your destiny or somebody else will"

          ~Jack Welsh~:h

          God grant me the serenity to accept the people I cannot change, the courage to change the one I can, and the wisdom to know it's me. ~Author unknown, :thumbs:

          Comment


            #6
            Should I Mod or Abstain???

            Just bumping this up so Newbies can read...

            Just bumpin'
            :bump:
            It is not how much we have, but how much we enjoy, that brings us happiness.
            ~ Charles Spurgeon

            Comment


              #7
              Should I Mod or Abstain???

              Sounds like a load of BS to me. Seems like this "modding" system has you obsessing about units, limits, counting days, etc. What's the fun of that? If you can handle your booze, you should just drink without worries and without obsessing about keeping track of your drinking. You are bullshitting yourself. If you have to go to all those lengths to control your drinking, you have a serious drinking problem. If you have a serious drinking problem, you either stop drinking of suffer the consequences of being a sot.

              Comment


                #8
                Should I Mod or Abstain???

                Hi and welcome C&S in Atlanta,
                I read on another post that you quit drinking 23 years ago and you are a member of AA. Firstly congrats on your sobriety and getting your life back in order.
                Secondly, I recommend you read the book "My Way Out" to understand what the program is all about. The program supports moderate drinking and should you read through some of the threads here in Long Term Moderation you will see that for some (not everyone) modding is possible.
                "The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it"

                Comment


                  #9
                  Should I Mod or Abstain???

                  C&S,
                  I think that all of us here have a serious drinking problem - that's why we are here. Sounds like this is not for you. We are different than you, and making a different choice. I respect that you are not making this choice, and hope that you will respect those who are different from you.
                  My life is better without alcohol, since 9/1/12. My sobriety tool is the list at permalink 236 on the toolbox thread under monthly abstinance.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Should I Mod or Abstain???

                    Sunbeam and Deebee

                    I love you two...
                    You are so sweet and so tactful!
                    As you know, I often am not,
                    and it's not a quality that I necessarily value in myself.
                    When people, friends or foes, aggravate me, I sometimes go in with both barrels blazing.
                    I hope I learn from listening to your far more gentle styles while I'm with MWO.
                    ~Kid~
                    It is not how much we have, but how much we enjoy, that brings us happiness.
                    ~ Charles Spurgeon

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Should I Mod or Abstain???

                      Kid,
                      We love you too, and you are forgiven, we are all still learning. It takes two to argue. I miss WIP because I learned more from her than anyone else here, but she definitely had that tendency to argue. State your piece and let it go, I say! I also like and use that "ignore" feature, when I don't want to listen to an individual any more, avoiding any temptation to respond again.
                      My life is better without alcohol, since 9/1/12. My sobriety tool is the list at permalink 236 on the toolbox thread under monthly abstinance.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Should I Mod or Abstain???

                        Old news for new Modders

                        Just reading the "old stuff'
                        "Stealin' the young girls hearts...
                        just like Gene and Roy.
                        Singin' those campfire songs..
                        Oh, I shoulda been a cowboy."

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Should I Mod or Abstain???

                          uh-huh....
                          "The person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it"

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Should I Mod or Abstain???

                            Can drink moderately but also prone to binges....what does it mean?

                            Dear All,

                            I am here to talk about moderation and what I call the 'Binge Monster' and would love some feedback. I am not sure I have written this with a huge amount of clarity but I think I have got my points across.....

                            I have posted on various pages on here but sit here now on this interesting thread really trying to seek a final answer to my constant dilemma.

                            Why is it that I am able to moderate my drinking on plenty of occasions(its usually situational, who I am with...eg if not with heavy drinkers, in the countryside, on a chilled dinner with friends or a girlfriend, I am in control and don't even want to get smashed.....BUT i also have frequent occasions where I really go way over the top[usually if out with all my heavy drinking mates, at a big party, a wedding with free flowing booze etc] ie situations where I almost decide to just go for it. These can be very detrimental in that I feel crappy and not really myself/in control the next day and often will drink again heavily the following night....then ending up with a really bad hangover and a prolonged recovery time.

                            Anyway, what I am trying to say is....

                            If I am able to moderate at all, does that mean with hard work and dedication(alongside therapy to understand myself better, underlying reasons why I do binge etc, which I am about to embark upon) I should be able to achieve continued moderation? Or will that party 'lets get smashed' monster always lurk? I am 32 so really am at stage where outright drunkeness and crazy shenanigans should be a thing of the past.

                            And if I am attempting moderation, what really is the most fail safe plan in your opinions to give oneself the best shot at achieving this?

                            Or, is the fact that I do have the binge tendency a sign that actually I should just accept there is an irreversible problem(that will always crop up) and just concentrate on stopping altogether?

                            As I'm sure the majority of people here may agree, having to stop drinking is not the most preferred option at all. I enjoy it. Not always the consequences, but the night itself. I am a happy drunk, not violent, a little crazy perhaps and some memory loss but doing it 'to have fun', not run away from problems.

                            Drinking does help me to relax and I cannot deny that in many social situations(especially when others ie friends are drinking and getting the glow, I feel quite uncomfortable if I am not drinking) . Perhaps this is a problem in itself? But i have heard loads of friends say they find nights out when they are not drinking(i.e driving or whatever) quite hard.

                            I really need to get to the bottom of this question.....is it within my power(i know we are a ll diff etc but I am just looking for general opinion here) to achieve a life of fun balanced and non-consequential drinking or am I fooling myself?

                            I know this is a long standing debate but I just wanted to open it up again here and now as I would love some feedback. I am speaking with my family tomoro(they know that I am stressing over this decision....) and want to present a valid argument.

                            Furthermore, I do actually feel that abstinence can be as dangerous as attempting to mod. That binge will creep up anyway.....the big Q is, can I get rid of the binge monster once and for all and how?

                            Many Thanks

                            Charlie
                            I am well and truly in recovery, I thank Baclofen, the good people of MWO and my love of spirituality, the combination of which have helped to guide me out of the darkness in the last couple months. Cheers to that.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Should I Mod or Abstain???

                              Wow Charlie, :welcome:

                              In many ways I could have written this same letter. It drives me crazy too ... why I can control it sometimes. Why I can feel totally fine with 2 on an evening out and not need to come home and sneak a third. Why can I do it sometimes... moderate so well... and then other times totally blow it?

                              The answer: I am a high functioning alcoholic.

                              Whether it's an enzyme I'm missing that makes me process alcohol differently or whatever the heck it is there is no guarantee for me that I can always regulate or moderate my drinking as I want to do. So, by continuing to drink I risk bad consequences.

                              Coming here has helped me to really think long and hard about what I'm doing and the times I've gone over my limits the effects have thankfully been less devastating as I've made big changes. I don't drink and drive - I try not to go over my limits when my kids are around...things like that. But I am still risking having a stupid fight, or having my kids see me drunk again or anything...because I continue to choose to drink and "try" to regulate/moderate my drinking.

                              Just last night I was at an all you can eat/drink event. I was boasting to my friend how I felt like a normal drinker. I had had my limit and was feeling satisfied. The minute she said she was going to have another one the boat sank for me. All my resolve went out the window and then I wanted another one too.

                              So, I can moderate better when co-dependent, wonderful hubby is "watching" out for me. I can moderate pretty well when we go out to dinner and have two in an evening. I can go out alone to a work event and have only one with dinner as I'll be driving (the one will be over 2-3 hours so pretty much out of my system by the time I drive). But when I have trouble is trying to have a glass of wine at home (open a bottle and believe me I'll finish it off - I just feel compelled to go back again and again) and the big party things are my downfall as well. With lots of folks drinking and if in a crowd with big, bad drinkers I just get sucked down into their hole as well. So, being the hallmark of alcoholism is loss of control...how can I believe I am not one when I experience many episodes of loss of control while trying to be a "moderate" drinker?

                              Like you, I hate to go completely AF. I want to believe I can moderate. I really, really do. But can I?
                              I'm still trying to answer that one.

                              Welcome Charlie, take comfort in the fact that you're not alone in your struggles.
                              :l
                              Eve11
                              "Control your destiny or somebody else will"

                              ~Jack Welsh~:h

                              God grant me the serenity to accept the people I cannot change, the courage to change the one I can, and the wisdom to know it's me. ~Author unknown, :thumbs:

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