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    Thinking of Moderation??

    Very interesting article I wanted to share:

    Moderation may be answer for certain drinkers
    03/23/2010 01:00 AM EDT
    By Douglas Brown

    The Denver Post
    Dianne Drake Foss first took to wine because she liked how it tasted and appreciated how it enhanced food.

    But over time, the sips with dinner became goblets of cabernet before, during and after the meal. Then Foss started hiding her drinks in glasses not meant for wine.

    She knew she had a problem.

    One option was abstinence. But she found another: moderation.

    ?For a lot of people who are problem drinkers, myself included, to think of never drinking wine again, when it?s a big part of what we do, I thought there must be something I can do where I can drink some wine, enjoy it, but not feel bad about it,? Foss said.
    Instead of denying herself the pleasures of a good burgundy, Foss joined Moderation Management, a recovery and national support group that teaches members how to drink responsibly and in moderation. The organization holds weekly meetings, during which participants trade tips about how to drink moderately and talk about their triumphs ? and trip-ups ? with imbibing responsibly.

    Foss is leader of the Colorado group, which meets in Denver.

    Many moderate drinkers never struggle with the bottle. Their spouses don?t fret, their bosses don?t sigh, they don?t wake up on Saturdays feeling like their skull is clamped in a vise.

    But plenty who think of themselves as reasonable drinkers do flirt with trouble. They aren?t chronic alcoholics ? people whose attachment to alcohol is soul-deep ? but their drinking sometimes spawns problems.

    These drinkers, Foss said, abuse alcohol. Alcoholics are dependent upon it.

    Just like chronic drinkers, who can choose from a variety of treatment programs (most of which revolve around abstinence), some experts think many moderate drinkers could use help, too.

    ?If people are concerned about it, there are resources other than Alcoholics Anonymous. There are treatment resources that aren?t going to wag their finger at them,? said Mark Ilgen, a professor of psychiatry at the University of Michigan. ?The point is that if someone is wondering, ?Hey, should I be doing something to scale back my drinking?? there are treatment options out there.?

    To be sure, Alcoholics Anonymous and other abstinence-oriented treatment programs are valuable.

    ?AA is the best form of recovery we have. Is it the only one? No. But it?s the best way to have a healthy, productive, sober life,? said Frank Lisnow, executive director of The Center for Dependency, Addiction and Rehabilitation at the University of Colorado Hospital.
    Lisnow said ?moderate drinker? is the most difficult term to define in the alcohol-treatment lexicon. And for him, drinkers with alcohol-related problems, even if they think of themselves as ?moderate,? are often fooling themselves.

    ?The definition we use is, ?Has your drinking caused unmanageabilities in your life? Going to jail? Losing your job? ? he said. Your spouse leaving you??

    ?Those are obvious. But are you a poor father, do you come home and pass out or emotionally abuse your kids? Is your job performance suffering? Often, moderate drinkers are in denial. If you are a moderate drinker and problems are surfacing, then you have a problem. It?s all about what is happening, not about how much you drink.?

    But for many people who drink ? sometimes a bit too much ? committing to a lifetime of abstinence is a step too far. And this big step keeps them away from seeking help.
    Alcoholics Anonymous? approach is strict. To belong to AA is to cease drinking, to embrace a 12-step program that invokes a ?higher power.? It?s a lifestyle.
    Abstinence clearly works. But current research shows that most people whose drinking morphs into a dependence recover on their own, according to findings from the National Epidemiologic Study on Alcohol and Related Conditions. The data was collected between 2001 and 2005.

    Drinking problems are ?not like pregnancy? ? either you?re pregnant, or you?re not ? but instead they are ?more like hypertension,? something that can be managed, said Reid Hester, a New Mexico psychologist who has studied moderate drinking for 30 years. Hester sits on the board of Moderation Management.Resources

    ?Moderation Management, moderation.org. This Web site is full of information about moderate drinking.
    ?Drinkerscheckup.com, a free service that offers a screening, to see if you need to moderate your drinking, and then a registration and assessment if you do.
    ?Moderatedrinking.com, affiliated with drinkers checkup.com, contains helpful information.
    ?Rethinkingdrinking.niaaa.
    nih.gov, a Web site sponsored by the federal government that helps people understand moderate drinking and how to achieve it.
    Our beloved MWO (unfortunately not listed in the article) but we're so glad it's here!

    :l
    Eve11
    "Control your destiny or somebody else will"

    ~Jack Welsh~:h

    God grant me the serenity to accept the people I cannot change, the courage to change the one I can, and the wisdom to know it's me. ~Author unknown, :thumbs:

    #2
    Thinking of Moderation??

    hi eve,interesting topic,,one of the key issues is research,in society were tot everything else,is it so odd to teach one how to drink properly ? is drinking normal ? try saying that in a treatment center,and see how long your stay is ? or as you say.at an AA meeting ? we only here of the billions of dollars spent on stopping ? can you amagine being told its gonna cost you 30 days,at a cost of 10,000 dollars to teach you how to drink.eve ive tried all 3,stopping,moderating and drunkeness,i beleive when one has to constantly think about it,there are unlying issues,not necessarily ,being an alchoholic,again another Key word,understanding and choice,im yakkin,thankyou,gyco

    Comment


      #3
      Thinking of Moderation??

      Yes, this is me. Thinking of moderating, "drinking sometimes spawns problems". Thanks for sharing - interesting article. I was just reflecting on my time here and looking back on drink tracker to October 2008 through April 2009 when I first came and tried moderating after 30 days AF. Not to great success, but definitely better than what my usual drinking level was. Then, I stopped posting and went right back into daily drinking. Not always at levels out of control, but sometimes. Came back in February when I decided at lent to try AF again. New approach/plan this time - only drink on special occasions. I will not buy wine to keep at home! So far so good - only had 2 drinks on easter; nothing since then. I keep asking myself am I really going to stick with this? I hope I will. I guess time will tell. I will check out these resources and see what they have to say. I just know that if I continued at the levels I was at, I'm sure I would have been 'fine', probably for years with occasional stumbling points where I'd be telling myself I wish I didn't do that, but eventually, it would have gotten to the 'chronic alcoholic' point.

      Last year, I read Drinking, A Love Story and she talks about how so many people who drink look at alcoholics who are at late stage and they think - well, that's not me, I'm not like that - I'm fine. But the truth is many people with drinking problems that get to that point drank for years and years and were 'fine'. Though some people have bad problems early in their drinking life, many or most go for years and years but eventually, can get to that point. I've seen it first hand with my best friend's mother. I don't want that to be me.

      Thanks for posting this!

      Comment


        #4
        Thinking of Moderation??

        Gyco - not yakkin at all! What you said about teaching people to drink makes so much sense. People frequently need to be taught how to eat - and frequently make food choices that, over time, put their lives at risk. This is happening at earlier and earlier ages, too. You also mention the billions of dollars spent on helping people to stop drinking - the other side of that coin is the billions spent on getting them to start. It would be very interesting and informative to know how much is spent advertising alcohol - especially to young people - and how much is earned in profits. Similar forces are at work in both the industry that causes us to make unhealthy food choices (serious problems with this one)and the one that promotes drinking.

        The article that Eve quotes mentions AA as the best treatment option for recovery. It's very hard to get the figures on success rates, but my superficial research has returned: 5-15% on several occasions, 3-5%, and less than zero. If I worked in the alcohol addiction field, I'd be looking for a better treatment model. Increasingly I'm seeing that doctors and other workers are looking to moderation and harm reduction for certain situations. Obviously this doesn't work for everyone, but perhaps a more nuanced approach can work for others...

        I will occasionally have french fries with salt - even though I know it's really, really bad for me. I will sometimes have meat, even though the industry is repulsive. I will sometimes buy on credit, even though that is a slippery slope and requires self-discipline. And I will continue to drink, with self-awareness and attention. Because this is where I live, and I am imperfect.

        *braces self for backlash*
        "Kinda brainy, but with no common sense..." by permission of Anotherday

        Comment


          #5
          Thinking of Moderation??

          Eve11;835753 wrote:
          ‘Has your drinking caused unmanageabilities in your life? Going to jail? Losing your job? ” he said. Your spouse leaving you?’

          “Those are obvious. But are you a poor father, do you come home and pass out or emotionally abuse your kids? Is your job performance suffering? Often, moderate drinkers are in denial. If you are a moderate drinker and problems are surfacing, then you have a problem. It’s all about what is happening, not about how much you drink.”

          I think what people with alcohol abuse problems forget is that for many of them their lives are still manageable. They are still functioning well in society, holding down jobs, if moderating then limiting drinking so they're not drinking/driving over DUI limits, etc.

          As Gyco said however, ,
          i beleive when one has to constantly think about it,there are unlying issue...
          I have to agree Gyco, anyone who comes here for support and help has underlying issues with alcohol. The question is, is the best we can hope fors harm reduction with too many slips here and there showing us that successful moderation is impossible? Or can some people truly moderate successfully.

          I myself have had too many slips lately where I've gone past my limit of no more than 3 in an evening. I know my triggers and have gone against what I know for no good reason other than just feeling like I wanted to do it.

          The online support is good but for me I find it's not good enough.

          I am going to start a weekly thread for those who are serious with accountability for weekly goals. Every Tuesday I'll start it (as Mondays can be too busy for most folk's) where we'll seriously discuss goal setting, self monitoring, progress we're making (or not), etc.

          As Frances said, But the truth is many people with drinking problems that get to that point drank for years and years and were 'fine'. Though some people have bad problems early in their drinking life, many or most go for years and years but eventually, can get to that point. I've seen it first hand with my best friend's mother. I don't want that to be me.


          I noticed recently that I went way past my goals and was able to function fine on more alcohol than I can usually handle. My family couldn't even tell I was drunk!! That...is scary. It makes me fear my tolerance is building up and I'm going down the true alcoholic pathway of tolerating more and more and needing more to get high because the tolerance is increased.

          CanadianGirl,
          You made a good point. Even AA folks don't have a high success rate. They slip and relapse too. But if we're going to be serious about moderating and being successful at it then maybe we all need to pact more, self monitor more and bring to this table everything we can to help each other be a success.

          Look for Ruby Tuesday's thread starting Tues, April 13th for some serious goal setting!
          :l
          Eve11
          "Control your destiny or somebody else will"

          ~Jack Welsh~:h

          God grant me the serenity to accept the people I cannot change, the courage to change the one I can, and the wisdom to know it's me. ~Author unknown, :thumbs:

          Comment


            #6
            Thinking of Moderation??

            very interesting...i can relate to the special occasion thing. good work, not having any since easter. that's what i want to do, too

            Comment


              #7
              Thinking of Moderation??

              I'm happy with the 'special occasion' rule so far. (key words, so far) I've found that, so far, it helps with eliminating all the thinking that goes into moderating. I don't have to worry about drinking on 'normal' days and how many i should allow myself to have, etc. and it pretty much eliminates any worry about sticking to a certain weekly limit - last time I did it that way, and I was always thinking about how many drinks I could have on any given day - it was a constant thought process. At least that way, I can put it right out of my mind.

              I really don't have that many special occasions in my life :-) So far so good!

              Comment


                #8
                Thinking of Moderation??

                Very interesting article and very interesting observations from everyone. ithis is my third month visiting MWO and I can say that I never felt better. I have managed reduce my AL intake significantly. The posts here have help me a lot. I have learned some much from your experiences that I can only be greatfull that I found this place. I agree with canadiangirl, I am not perfect, I know I have failed some times, but it's been 3 times in the past three months as apposed to 2 to 3 times a week before, and those 3 times weren't nearly as bad as it used to be. I still have a lot to learn and a lot to experience. Like frances, I constantly ask myself if I'm just fooling myself and imy drinking will go back to the way it was and then I wonder if I will just get worse and worse. What gives me confidence is knowing that eventhough my life is not, or was never, unmanageable, I still knew that I had a problem and that what I was doing was wrong, so I hope that if I go back to where I was, I will be able to know I failed moderating and that I would need to consider alternative approaches to my problem (abstinence), so I feel that I deserve a chance trying to moderate. I'm pretty proud of what I have accomplished and I owe it to this site. As of today, I believe moderating is possible, I hope I can keep saying this in the future. I plan to keep coming here for a long time and I plan to be honest about it. If this work, I want any one who comes here feeling how I was feeling to know that it is possible, I would like to help others and to support others the way I have felt helped and supported. And if I end up not being able to moderate, well I will keep coming here for support ad help to accomplish an AF life. I hope is the first....

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