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Eve11
October 1st, 2010, 04:06 PM
Hey modders,

A new month. Let's just say NO to overdrinking and keep within our mod limits.

How is everyone doing? My Master's Program is keeping me busy but I can't forget my mod buddies.

Let's post a catch up and let everyone know how we're all doing.

I definitely know I never feel good when I hit more than 2. We had our big 20th anniversary the other night and had a liqueur drink after our 2 glasses of wine and yes...I could feel it the next day. I HATE that!!!

I have GOT to stick with the 2 and I'm through thinking. That's what works best for me.

:l
Eve11

Sarasmiles
October 1st, 2010, 11:43 PM
Hi Eve!! Hello Mod Squad! I haven't been here in a long time, but I've been wanting to check in. I've been doing well with being AF almost every day since last February, when I had a bad episode that made me feel I should quit for good. Since then, I have had two drinks on a handful of occasions (three occasions, actually.) In some ways, it has been easier for me to abstain than to do the work of modding. Yet I have a very hard time completely letting go of the thought that I might be able to manage it. After all these years of trying and still finding that it takes a lot of effort to stay within my limits, one might think I would be able to just let go of alcohol and commit to lifetime abstinence. I have posted here in the past that that is what I intended to do. Maybe it still is. I don't know...I'm confused and needed to reach out for help.

I have thought often of my old friends here at MWO and I wonder who is still around...Maia? DeeBee? Sunbeam? I hope some old faces are still at the Mod Squad and are doing well. I will be reading to try and get to know everyone.

Take care everyone,

Sara

Sunbeam
October 2nd, 2010, 08:47 AM
Hi SaraSmiles,
I am still around, but posting with the newbies. At the moment that's what I need to go back to. I started a Sober September thread, and only caved twice for wine with dinner. That is my current plan, only wine with dinner, less than weekly. As much as I love people here, I can't hang out with people who drink more than I do, it doesn't help me meet my goals. I think the ODAT people come closer to sharing my thinking. In a few minutes we will leave for vacation for a week, I'm glad I caught you. DeeBee is still around, only posts under subscribers.

Eve11
October 2nd, 2010, 12:41 PM
Hi Sunbeam,

What you are saying makes sense. You are such an occasional drinker so it is probably easier for you to hang where people try not to drink at all rather than some of us who post here weekly who are trying to drink moderately but sometimes drinking more than the recommended health standard of no more than 7 per week for women.

I am working hard on trying to let go of the week-end drinking thinking. Just because it's Friday or Saturday night doesn't mean I have to have a drink. Seriously, if we were staying home one of those nights I would always break open a bottle of wine with dinner because it was the week-end. I am definitely trying to get away from that thinking and just have the occasional drink when out to a function (wedding, party, etc.) and it's a fun and social thing to do.

Sara,
Good to hear from you. I know the big Feb. scare made you fearful to ever lose control like that again and the problem with returning to a drink here and there is "Can a problem drinker always control it or will they have an episode where they get fooled and then have major consequences to pay?"

I still struggle with maintaining to no more than 2 at all times and so that isn't complete control in my book either. Reintroducing alcohol into our systems here and there keeps us in the constant craving mode (where is k.d. Lang when I need her?) Oh...here she is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXqPjx94YMg&feature=related[/video]]YouTube - k.d. lang - Constant Craving (Video) (http://[video=youtube_share;oXqPjx94YMg)

So, that is the price modders pay. With abstaining, that craving really does dissipate over time. But when we keep bringing it back in, we continue to crave it. But at what price??

Only we can determine that for ourselves.

Hugs, :l
Eve11

Sarasmiles
October 2nd, 2010, 03:30 PM
Hi Sunbeam and Eve,

I can understand what you're saying too, Sunbeam. Maybe ODAT is the right place for me, too.

Eve, I agree completely that occasional drinking keeps the cravings alive, and they do dissipate over time if one abstains. I was AF for about 170 days, and had been feeling good and pretty much craving free. Then one day I was visiting my mom, who said, "Gee, I wish you could have a drink with me. Just one! While we sit on the porch and talk." That did it for me. I did stick to the one, but from that day on it seemed the cravings and thoughts were back. I stayed AF for about 3 weeks after that, and then another occasion came up when I decided to have wine. That time it was two glasses. So I nipped that in the bud and went several more weeks before once again having a couple of glasses. I have stayed "in control", but it has been uncomfortable, agonizing once again about whether it is worth it to me to mod.

Which leads me to a question: What makes modding "worth it"? It seems most of us feel that it's harder than abstaining. So why mod? I think for me there is some way in which I feel deeply deprived by the thought that I will never drink again. I'm sure that for it to have that much importance is simply further proof of my alcoholism. I don't know how to ever let go of the wish to be able to drink.

Thanks for still being here!

Sara

Eve11
October 2nd, 2010, 05:50 PM
Dependence versus misuse

I think what I am learning Sara is that there is a HUGE difference between alcohol dependence and addiction versus alcohol “misuse/abuse.”

Everyone who comes here should consider taking one of the screening tests to help them determine whether they are dependent or not. Many are offered online.

A diagnosis of dependence should only be made if three or more of the following have been experienced or exhibited at some time in the previous twelve months:

1. A strong desire or a strong desire or sense of compulsion to drink.

2. Difficulties in controlling drinking in terms of onset, termination, or levels of
use.

3. A physiological withdrawal state when alcohol use has ceased or been reduced, or use of alcohol to relieve or avoid withdrawal symptoms (e.g. drink in the morning to calm jittery nerves).

4. Evidence of tolerance, such that increased doses of alcohol are required to achieve effects originally produced by lower doses.

5. Progressive neglect of alternative pleasures or interests because of alcohol use.

6. Continued use despite clear evidence of harmful consequences Harmful use is defined as a pattern of drinking that is already causing damage to health. The damage may be either physical (e.g., liver damage from chronic drinking) or mental (e.g., depressive
episodes secondary to drinking). Harmful patterns of use are often criticized by others and are sometimes associated with adverse social consequences of various kinds.

Looking at one’s pattern of drinking is important as well. Some people may drink in large quantities on particular occasions, but may not drink more than recommended amounts on a regular, weekly basis. Such drinking to the point of intoxication presents an acute form of risk involving injuries, violence, and loss of control affecting others as well as themselves.

Other folks may drink excessively on a regular basis and, having established an increased tolerance for alcohol, may not demonstrate marked impairment at high blood alcohol levels. But the chronic excessive consumption presents risks of long-term medical conditions such
as liver damage, certain cancers, and psychological disorders.

I recently just learned of a tool called Brief interventions (BI). It is aimed to identify a real or potential alcohol problem and motivate an individual to do something about it.

I do believe people can learn to moderate and can moderate as long as they are NOT alcohol dependent.

Because most of us have found this site because of problems related to alcohol and feeling the need to do something about it, most can’t moderate because they are dependent and not just abusing/misusing alcohol.

For those folks who can afford therapy and have concerns, you may want to shop around for a therapist who understands BI or Motivational Interviewing Motivational interviewing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motivational_interviewing) to assist with learning new behaviors and thinking to help with alcohol misuse problems.

Perhaps then you could learn to moderate or if it was determined you are dependent then abstaining would be the best choice and ongoing support (like A.A.) could help you get through the one day at a time concept. I think the thing that throws folks is the thought "I can never have a drink again?!" but with ODAT thinking, people learn to do just that. Get through one day and then the next and so on and so on.

:l
Eve11

Doggygirl
October 2nd, 2010, 06:05 PM
Excellent post Eve. I'm very sure it will be helpful to people.

I won't get into how many more than three of those thingys I have experienced since we already know what side of the fence I am on with old AL!

DG

Rusty
October 3rd, 2010, 08:22 AM
Hi Eve,

Thank you for posting this valuable information! I took this test that you posted and I would say that I could answer "yes" to 2 of the questions in the last year. After consulting my friends, family and therapists, they agree 2 is the best answer. If you knew my friends and family, you would agree that they are brutally blunt. I absolutely believe ODAT is the way to go!

Thank you again for taking the time and providing valuable insight.:)

Rusty
October 3rd, 2010, 08:29 AM
Hi Mod Squad,

I usually post under the Abstainers thread so I hope you don't mind if I jump in. I have been mostly AF the last 5 months now (geez, I was thinking it was 4...time flies) . My drinking patterns mimic Sara's. Eve, I love k.d. lang's song...."Constant Craving."

Eve11
October 3rd, 2010, 11:55 AM
Hey Rusty,

Thanks for stopping over. The thing about friends (you mentiioned you consulted with them) is they can give very good objective information. Sometimes we just can't see ourselves.

I do believe there is the misuser/abuser who has maybe gotten a DUI (e.g. young college kid, inexperienced with drinking and the poor judgment that comes with it) who finds us, isn't dependent and can learn to drink responsibly and moderate well. That's mostly what Brief Intervention is about.

There are many free online screening tests so before a person considers moderating they should take one of these tests. This is a half joke but a potential moderator said he got high off of the smell of windshield wiper fluid. Now do we really think he could ever moderate??

C.A.G.E. is another test to take to determine problems and it's short and easy.
C-cut
A annoyed
G guilty
E eye-opener

1. Have you ever felt you should cut down on your drinking?

2. Have people annoyed you by criticizing your drinking?

3. Have you ever felt bad or guilty about your drinking?

4. Have you ever had a drink first drink (eyeopener) in the morning to steady nerves or get rid of a hangover?

Scoring: Two or three affirmative answers should create a high index of suspicion. Four positive answers indicate alcoholism.


Sometimes moderating are the baby steps that lead to abstinence. Yet, sometimes it's about learning new techniques to drink responsibly. Being accountable to other modders here helps us reach our goals.

The trick is finding our way in what really works for us and sometimes that's the biggest struggle of all.

Good luck to you Rusty! The one day at a time thinking really does help!!!!

:l
Eve11

Sarasmiles
October 4th, 2010, 12:10 AM
Thank you Eve. I have to say I answered yes two of the questions in the first assessment you shared. The first two: At times I have strong desires to drink that can be difficult (though not impossible) to control. And I have of course sometimes had difficulty controlling the amount I drank (ie, I would plan to have two drinks and end up having three or four or five. Or I would not plan anything, and would impulsively pour a drink when stressed out or tense, and then pour more without taking the time to think about it.

Hi Rusty. It's good to hear from someone who's patterns are like mine. I hope I'll see you around!

Take care everyone, and thanks Eve.

Sara

Eve11
October 21st, 2010, 01:16 AM
Hi gang,
Haven't posted in a while. Have been keeping to my goals but have found struggling a bit in the evening for some reason with really desiring a glass of wine (which I know would lead to two) and I hate to do that on school nights for the kids and work nights for me so I just keep delaying it, drinking other things (like selzer and cranberry) and it's interesting to note that the craving passes.

Alcohol is such a demotivator for me that I know even 1 glass would make me not want to do any homework (or any more homework if I had started) and I rarely spring out of bed with drinking a couple like I do when I drink zilch. So...hanging in there...how about you?

Eve11