Forgivness

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I am putting this out to my cyber friends to see if they can offer any insight to an issue I am dealing with.

Some things have happened that I have put my family at a distance. Somehow I think that this is good for now. I am dealing with unresolved issues. Issues that I thought I had forgiven, but when all this happened it resurfaced. I realized that I had not forgiven, because I refused to forget. So here it is,

Growing up my Dad drank too much. Put my little sister on a pestal and made her a princess. I on the other hand was told how worthless and unloved I was. Some really ugly memories are coming to surface. The worst being the day I got a phone call that 5 of my friends had been in a really bad car accident. While I was getting ready (I was 16 at the time) to go to the hospital my Dad came in (no words of concern for my friends) and asked me if I fed the dog. I responded with a very smart allack "what?"--he then punched me in the face an gave me a bloody nose. Two days later when my sister questioned him about this he said that he was glad he did it because I deserved it. This is the worst memory, but I grew up 24/7 just dreading my Dad. Through it all my Mom either stood by him or added to the hurtful feelings. No support, no direction, no nothing. I will readily agree that I wasn't the easiest teenager, but I can also see what contributed to that.

Now my Dad is a changed man. He still drinks, but very lightly now. He no longer has that same attitude towards me. But he changed, and try as I might, I just can't forgive. Even though I know that both my parents came from dysfunctional families and never had good role models to parent--I can't get past it.

Maybe its because they seemed to pull it out for my sister and not me. Maybe its because I was never loved or nurtured through my most difficult years. I felt abandoned. And because of that I tend to always feel somewhat worthless and shut out anyone who I think could injure me like that.

If anyone has been through this, I would love some insight. How to move on, let the past be the past. How to have a decent realtionship with my family and not wing this in their faces everytime things get tough.

Guess i just need some cheap therapy.

[Guest]

Forgivness

Dear God discovery...I want to digest, think, meditate on this & do it the justice you deserve. You are very brave to put his out. For now..first you are loved and obviously a beautiful being for trying to do forgiveness.

I feel for you & this. My father was emotionally abusive, not physical...but I had very similar feelings & at some point knew that "I" needed to forgive -- for my own health, for myself. And so you truly should pursue this as you are doing...

Truth is you did not have good parents. Sound harsh? Oh they may be good decent people, but they were not good parents -- to you. And you were damaged a bit as as result.

Truth is you were not a "bad" teenager or girl and are not now. That is part of the guilt of not respecting your parents. And it is OK.

Good news -- you can heal.

Don't know how old you are -- I think this takes awhile -- in fact I just recently was able to clearly state "I was emotionally abused". So be patient with yourself..

I think this is big, huge. Cheap therapy can help. But real therapy would be much much better for you. Perhaps you can find a way for that. Also -- prayer, reading, healing groups, others with the same issues -- in person. Forgiveness is deep, complex but extremely powerful healing agent. I hope you believe in God and can tap in there. Luv ~Chrysa (hope I did not overstep dear)

[Guest]

Forgivness

Hi Discovery,

First, I must say that you are very brave to just put your feelings out there so bravely and so baldly without any sugar coating!!! I admire you for that!

My personal experience is that true forgiveness doesn't really occur until the anger and hurt has really run its course. Your parents didn't treat you well. Perhaps you were difficult, but, as you said, your parents, and particularly your dad, magnified that. Your mom, by supporting his abuse, contributed to the feeling that it was your fault for being abused! Hello!!! Who were the parents????

I had a very hard time with my mother. She had a very hard time with the fact that I was inquisitive and independent as a child ( she preferred passive and obedient!! ) Before I was 20, she and I probably said the most horrible things to each other that two human beings could say! We even hit each other too on a few occasions! Yes, I was very scarred by that. I've had a lot of therapy (an embarrassing amount!!:eek ). I've had a number of different therapists over the years, but I can say that my most recent therapist has, in many ways, been my "other mother", and my attachment to her is very strong. She has helped me to grow up so much! Most of what remains is dealing with the alcohol issue. (Yuck!)

Part of my healing has been coming to terms with the parts of myself that are LIKE HER:eek :eek . Part of it has been talking to her about how I have felt and having her listen, even though I know she will never really understand how it felt to be me. She was willing to listen to me, though, and it made all the difference!(That has been a gift that many aren't able to get from their parents, I know.) The rest of it has been understanding that what SHE went through as a child was even worse than what she put me through!! My childhood was like a 1950's sitcom compared to hers!!

Are you able to talk to your father about this, or is it too painful for him to acknowledge how he treated you when he was drinking heavily? At any rate, I echo Chrysa's sentiments and recommend some counseling and/or support group stuff, Discovery. I went through the bad daughter/good daughter (my sister was the good one>: ) stuff too, and it is a nightmare.

MWO can be PART of your therapy, in that it can be very therapeutic for you, and anything that is therapeutic will be valuable in your journey toward healing. But it isn't the same as therapy, a one-on-one relationship that you will build with someone that will REALLY help to heal those injuries and DEEPLY understand you!

Your cyber friend!
Kathy:h :d

[Guest]

Forgivness

I luv ya, Kim.
Although I never had to experience this kind of pain with my parents (thanks, mom and dad!:h ), you have expressed these feelings with your family before, and I know you are still hurting. I wish you were in town last night! I was there and could have given you a hug!:d Well, what you seem to need right now is good advice, and Chrysa and Kathy are wonderful advisors.
Kim, do you listen to Glenn Beck by any chance? I just love the guy. He talks a lot about how much our parents screwed us up and we grow up just trying to survive our childhoods! He is a bonified AA grad. Totally abs. Several years. Was a self proclaimed alcoholic who was ruining his life. He does say that abs is the only way... I need to talk to the man as I'm a huge fan....
ANYHOW....you are a VERY STRONG woman, Kim. Perhaps you can say what you need to say to your parents and then move on. Please be careful. Never create a rift you cannot mend. Life is too short. If your parents need to know how much they hurt you then, I say, tell them, then friggen PLEASE move on. My sister in law's dad just had a massive stroke and will never walk again. He just got out of ICU. Having a hard time carrying on a conversation. HE's 57

Love ya, girl. I'm glad you posted this. Hope it moves toward your healing. Every step forward.... it's good.
Becca

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Forgivness

forgivness

Hi Discovery,
A lot comes to my mind on this subject. And oh boy.....I am far from an expert. I feel I can be forgiving but one of those never forgetters. But the childhood crap goes so deep. I feel I have done a lot of work on my child. Me that is, my inner child. I like John Bradshaw. So I mean the kind of work that as an adult....goin into my inner child and nuturing my spirit and loving the part of me I felt got negelected and abandoned as a child. The part that my parents didn't do. The part that they didnt mean to not do but none the less. Still...the empty part. It really did help. So much to it, I havent even begun to explain. But its like the addict in us. Yes there are so many things that caused us to be that way, But its up to us to fix it. I'm sorry, and its not fair. It would be great for you to be able to talk to your mom and dad and for them to tell you that they didnt mean any of what they did to you. That if they could do it all over again they would change everything. That they really did love you as much as your sister and all that stuff. If they said it with tears streaming down their face and you KNEW they ment it, STILL.....your heart would ache. The damage and the scars would still be done to your spirit. Their words of apology probably would not heal you. YOU would still have to be the one to fix you just like the alcoholic would still be the alcoholic that needs to fix his drinking addiction.
I hope this makes sense.
So yes I to agree with therapy. And it could take a long time.
That song by Don Henley is in my head right now. Forgivness. I bet you know it. Without getting to that point of forgivness.......the anger will just eat you up inside. I bet you feel it now. Great Song. So much engery to hold on to that tho. Gotta be wearing you out. Certainly enough to drive ya to drink and there ya have anther problem to fix. Damm this stuff!
And plus.....I just wonder too....your dad who you say has changed...Maybe, just maybe he DOES feel all that stuff like I said up there and he just doesnt know how to communicate it to you. I know my dad wouldnt know how to. OMG.....dont be talkin about feelings!!!!! I dont know....all this is just a guess. Something to think about tho. I do hope I haven't over stepped. Also I hope you can work though this in their lifetime. Its harder after they die...I only say that cuz I know it from personal experience. :c
gabby

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Forgivness

Re: forgivness

Well...talk about not feeling alone...:h
...discovery, gabby, kath...thank you
..(I really need that joy tears /God tears smiley icon)

[Guest]

Forgivness

Re: forgivness

you are beautiful people thank you

[Guest]

Forgivness

Re: forgivness

This is what I mean about our community being an absolutley amazing evolution. Wish I knew what to add, but the wise posts before I can agree with. Not pushing this down any further and taking this very brave step will inch you ever closer to emotional healing. I can't imagine the pain you must have suffered Kim. Thank you for reaching out instead of stuffing your feelings. I never dreamed that an online forum could really change people......until now. I've seen it happen to many here including myself. It will happen for you too. Be encouraged, you are loved and valued here.
:d Lori

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Forgivness

Re:forgiveness

Hi Discovery
I can absolutely relate to your story, only with me, it was my mother. I was the older child and as soon as I started "talking back" I guess my mother became threatened and we started clashing. As far back as I can remember, we faught, first with words, and as our fighting (and her drinking) progressed, with her fists (well, actually with her hands and high heeled shoes and feet). She never ever touched my sister though, for some reason, though my sister also "talked back" to her. When I was 16, and taller than her, I pinned her against a wall and threatened her that if she ever touched me again, I would seriously hurt her. She rarely touched me again after that.
My mother has not laid a hand on me in 10 years. She doesnt speak abusively to me. Yet, I still harbour deep resentment toward her. I have real trouble forgiving her (and I think I also resent her because she is very intrusive towards me). I, too, seek for ways to get past the anger but the fact is, I know I don't know how to. She tries really hard to have a positive relationship and i know she loves me. But I still have a lot of hostility towards her. I dont know what to do either. Not sure how much this helps - just wanted you to know - there is yet another person out there who understands.
Luv ya!
Jen

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Forgivness

Re: Forgiveness

Hi Discovery,
Never thought I would be tempted to share this with anyone. I too, was severely abused by my mother. She was not drinking, but was addicted to a religious sect. She beat me regularly with a carpet beater (tool of choice) for whatever indiscretion. It became so bad that I simply would not come home after school and hang out until I knew my father would be home. These were my elementary school years. I literally moved into the local public library, helping the librarian putting away the returned books in exchange for shelter. Got to read alot.
As I got older I started to fight back and when I turned 15 I told her that I will hit her back if she ever touched me again. She never missed an opportunity to point out to her friends how unfortunate she was having born such a bad seed - I simply could not do anything right and in a way I am trying to this day to get my mothers approval. When I got married, my mother said she could not believe that daughter of hers would get married in white. That was so hurtful. Whenever good things happened to me, I always felt I was not deserving of them. My hatred and anger were raging for years. My husband and I emmigrated to Canada and the distance did me a world of good. I blossomed. As soon as we had a home of our own, my mother would come every summer from Europe. The fights were endless and she knew how to push all my buttons, until one day I decided that I would not let this happen anymore and all of a sudden, she had no control over me. Many years passed and I learned to let go of the roiling, self-destructive hate that I felt. I actually managed to forgive her, for my daughters sake, as she neither knows nor would understand. Mother is an old woman now and I feel rather sorry for her for having wasted the better part of her and my emotional connection. I did not want children as I was afraid that I would inflict the same misery on my children that I had suffered for so long.
Well, that did not happen. My daughter and I have a wonderful relationship and a very strong bond. I guess I learned by personal experience what not to do to another creature.
Discovery, I know it is hard and takes a long time but forgiving my mother was the most liberating gift I could have possibly given to myself.
(((((hugs))))) Lori

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Forgivness

Re: Forgiveness

Lori, Way Big Good For You!
I am so glad you got to that place. Just so weird tho....cuz it just happened for you. Its almost like ya cant make it happen....ya just have to let it happen. Sometimes I think motherhood helps. Its like you know your done when your done. I think that why therapy helps so much cuz you get to DONE sooner....or better....I dont know but something.
I Have a lot of these issues right now with men too. Just because my marriage failed, in so many way i have taken it so personally. Here I am attractive and nice. Yet I feel unworthy of a good relationship from a decent man. yeeek.....lot to work on. speaking of that.....off to the gym
gabby
Actually....speaking of that....I think we need to start some kind of self esteem workshop or something. OK......new idea!!!!

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Forgivness

Forgiveness

Really want to keep this on the front burner for awhile. I really need this thread alot. I want to reread each story. I have a lot of thoughts, reactions, etc. I want to think & reply more --just don't have time right now. Extremely important sharing -- seems to me, anyway.

Lori(lorisunshine) ... I relate....the biggest most wonderful blessing I could ever have is the beautiful relationship I have with my daughter. I did not have it at all with my Mom & in my case was abused by my father (so nothing but negativity & hate there).

More later..thank you beautiful souls for sharing all this..can't help but think we are all stronger taht we give ourselves credit for....more later...~Luv~C

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Forgivness

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Ok, was abused (verbally) by dad, (sexually) by grandfather and neighbor...............felt guilt all my life, Drank to cover it ALL THE TIME!!!

Need therapy too probably, always hate the way I look, think I am fat, ugly.........

Gabby get that self concept/image thread going........I think next time I am in town i will go to the book store and buy the book by Dr. Phil


Mary Anne:h :P :happy

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Forgivness

Re: Forgiveness

Mary Anne, Go to amazon.com and as soon as you punch one book title it will give you lots of other on the same reading. Its better then goin to the book store. Plus shipping is free. Give it a looksie and see what ya think. There is so much on childhood abuse and stuff of the like. I was so used to the dysfunction/abuse in our family I didnt even know we had it. After a book or two.....sheese its like your on every page. Aint that great? Gabby

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Forgivness

Re: Forgiveness

Thanks so much to all of you for you insight. It helped tremendously!! And hope that for everyone that shared their pain it helped them as well. Somehow putting it out there like that has been somewhat healing. I always hear over and over how you need to be forgiving. I agree, but I never got the part on just how to do it on the really big stuff. I know that I am getting closer to it though.

Hugs to everyone!!

Kim