Marijuana Maintenance

[bloggy]

Marijuana Maintenance

Greg;634511 wrote: Thanks Marbella I guess I'm a bit paranoid about aggressive judgements because of an altercation I had with one of the Sinclair forum members. I had been trying to explain that I didn't think the method would help me on its own, since I have other issues that need strong treatment at the same time, but I didn't quite word it right and the member took it the wrong way. Anyway we sorted that out ages ago now. I tend to hang out here a lot more now since, as you know, my interest is mainly in other methods of recovery. Yes I do believe that there is more than one way, and different things suit different people. I didn't mention my bad reaction to naltrexone on the other forum since I didn't want to discourage anyone from trying the method.

I'll keep checking in here as often as I can, and try to start offering advice to others if I can, rather than just thinking of myself. It has been great to have others to discuss all this with. I've been back to a few AA meetings simply to have sober companionship at night, and while it works for that, I can't discuss anything about medication of course!

I can see you definitely know about anxiety from what you said. I have never heard of that supplement you mentioned but will look it up.

There are a few threads about the Holy Basil, one that caught my interest was that OverIt2007 went to her doctor and was told it would cure her along with bee pollen....seems a bit far fetched- but hey- who knows?!!

She is taking it and says she feels very good although she was obviously very skeptical- I think there are a number of us waiting for our orders right now

[Popeye]

Marijuana Maintenance

An interesting read.
Thanks.

I'm definately no expert but speaking personally, I've always been surprised that I didn't smoking pot. Half my friends did and my brother's always using it now. I was a bit of a sheep as a lad. I started smoking because everybody else was and drinking because it seemed the natural thing to do. A lot of the people I went to school with had a phase of sniffing glue from crisp packets and eating magic mushrooms but to me, that just seemed kind of stupid and frankly beneath me. A lot of those guys then graduated to the real heavy stuff and some of them are dead now. I'm not saying that pot necessarily leads to the hard stuff, I'm just sharing my people-watching experience.
I've heard a lot about the usefulness of marijuana and that it helps a lot of people with painful illnesses get through the day, so on that count there is a place for it, and as far as I can judge, it's no worse or damaging than alcohol or cigarettes and should be in a similar catagory.
I did try pot once, many years ago while I was drinking and it knocked me flat on my back, literally, and since then It's had no appeal to me.
I came in from work early one time and my daughter had a lump of the stuff sitting on the fireplace. She'd left home for a couple of years and I knew she was smoking it but I'm of the opinion that kids will try these things whether I want them to or not, so I just told her to be careful and NEVER let her mother see that stuff lying around the house.
That's about all I know on the subject.

[joeyforreal]

Marijuana Maintenance

it wasn't til recently (ironically on 4/20/10) that i learned the term "marijuana maintenance".
i was discussing with a friend in the program that i was having more of an urge to smoke pot lately than drink.
i was never really into marijuana. it's the first drug i've ever tried but it didn't always yield positive results (paranoia, bad "vibes", etc.). regardless, during the 7-8 years i spent drinking my life away, i was still an occasional pot user (4 or 5 times a year if that).
i told my friend about these cravings, and he made a joke about the marijuana maintenance program. he doesn't personally subscribe or necessarily even support the idea. he's works a great program and has remained sober for well over 12 years (with the help of his higher power and the good people of AA of course).

his advice was this:
stay as far away from any drug as possible. go to a meeting, pick up your phone, read your big book, go for a walk, watch tv, do some push-ups- do anything else you can think of. put whatever you can between you and your next drink/drug.
but he also said this...
if all else failed and i had exhausted all other resources, and i was definitely going to pick up, he'd rather i smoked pot than pick up a drink.

ironically, i still have more marijuana cravings than alcohol cravings, not sure why since i never actually CRAVED marijuana before (just smoked it when it happened to get passed my way), but i just don't bother with it. it's not worth figuring out the hard way that there's another drug i'm powerless over.

i do have friends recovering from opiate and benzo addiction who can no longer use anti-anxiety drugs due to the risk of relapse, and they've found that marijuana works for them to alleviate those symptoms. i also have a friend with brain cancer who uses it to get through the nausea of his chemo treatments.
it's a touchy subject. things become a little more understandable when there's physical or mental illness involved
i guess i'm still on the fence so to speak. i'm still in favor of legalizing marijuana for medical use (see above). it's on this planet for a reason, and God forbid if i ever have to deal with chemo or radiation, i'd prefer a natural remedy to a chemical one, but i guess as far as recreational use goes, high is high and it doesn't matter what it comes from.

i don't judge the people i know in the AA program that do use it. in a way i understand, and if that's what they need to do to keep from picking up another drink that's their decision. i haven't needed a "maintenace" substance so far in 9 months, and i've already had to deal with my fiance leaving, and my father passing. if i can make it through that without a drink or a drug during early sobriety, than God and the program/people of AA are obviously enough.

remember D.A.R.E.? just say no

[bobtoot666]

Marijuana Maintenance

My doctor advised me to smoke cannabis instead of drinking. I quote, "If you want to get off your head, stay away from drink and smoke a joint instead".

His reasoning is; No one has ever died from using cannabis, but thousands of people die each year from drinking. He said he also uses cannabis himself.

I use cannabis every night, I suppose I have substituted one drug for another, but in my view it's like getting addicted to AA or exercise.

I think most people who first try cannabis try taking FAR too much, I would have one toke and that would last me all night. The more you use it the more you need to get the same effect.

It seems the years of governments lying about the dangers of weed has rubbed off on people.
People are fine taking benzo's to alleviate symptoms, but are afraid to use a plant that grows out of the ground, and was once described as the most useful plant on earth.

In my humble opinion, taking ANY drug instead of alcohol is a step in the right direction. Some people's brains are chemically not capable of drinking in moderation, this doesn't mean you can't get a bit "buzzed" from other things. It's my right God damn it! :-p

I used to smoke weed constantly, then stopped for 12 years. I'm now back using it moderately in the evenings. It's kept me away from booze for 50 days so far, and I haven't become psychotic or schizophrenic.

Everyone's different though, but it's working for me.

[spacebebe01]

Marijuana Maintenance

I never liked pot

I never liked the effecta of pot so it could never be a subsitute for alcohol or any other drugs it just made me feel shit, so really i cant comment on its use but i think the criminality of it is the last thing you should worry about if your killing yourself with booze anyway.

[beatle]

Marijuana Maintenance

bobtoot666;934008 wrote:
People are fine taking benzo's to alleviate symptoms, but are afraid to use a plant that grows out of the ground, and was once described as the most useful plant on earth.

In my humble opinion, taking ANY drug instead of alcohol is a step in the right direction. Some people's brains are chemically not capable of drinking in moderation, this doesn't mean you can't get a bit "buzzed" from other things.

Everyone's different though, but it's working for me.

I agree, although I don't think that ANY drug is a step in the right direction -- I do think the aversion to drugs as a way out of alcoholism is overwhelmingly overdone. Most drugs ARE better than alcohol for our bodies. But many are equally as addictive as alcohol, and equally (if not more) difficult to withdraw from.

And yes, benzos are chemicals devised specifically to alter our minds and bodies. Marijuana is a natural substance. You could say the same about alcohol.

But apart from the legality issue, and apart from the fact that marijuana is not for me, I have to agree that marijuana is probably a better "substitute" than chemical substances as a relief for addictive behavior. If it works for you, that's great. Whatever works.

[Greg]

Marijuana Maintenance

Hi all, I only just remembered that I started this thread nearly a year ago, after noticing that a few people had recently commented on it! Thanks for everyone's opinion, your comments are interesting and informative. I haven't checked this site all that regularly so I look forward to reading all the other things written here lately.

I have been sober for nearly 7 months now but have been smoking pot as a way of continuing to have an 'emotional escape' at night. Depression has always been (by far) my main reason for drinking and getting drunk, but unfortunately marijuana has not helped that depression overall, although it may still have helped me keep away from alcohol...then again I have had a strong personal desire to keep off the booze so maybe that has played the biggest role.

All I can say now is that marijuana did help me greatly in some ways but it has also caused quite a few side effects. It is not a drug that agrees with me all that well to be honest, and being high on it is not a euphoric (or even very pleasant) experience for me. Others may find it a lot more helpful than I did, so best wishes to anyone who feels that pot may allow them to lose the compulsion to drink. Almost anything that can help someone stop drinking dangerously is at least a step in the right direction, even if it turns out not to be the full, long-term answer.

[moglor]

Marijuana Maintenance

I enjoy marijuana, but combining it with alcohol was always a bad idea for me, so I rarely smoked. It would really increase the amount I could drink before keeling over, and I became (rightfully) concerned that I'd wake up dead. Just prior to beginning my baclofen experiment, I had been drinking and smoking quite a lot, and I pretty much constantly felt like I was about to die.

Since I've essentially quit drinking (about 45 days now, with a few hiccups,) I find that small amounts of MJ provide a much needed dose of relaxation and enjoyment. It's nice to sit back in my chair with a smile on my face and zone out with some tunes secure in the knowledge that it's not rotting my liver, and that I won't be hungover in the morning. It's also nice that it's quasi-legal here in California, and there's really no stigma to smoking it.

It's certainly not for everyone though, and I suspect it's a co-morbidity or a trigger for a lot of people. Fortunately, it's not for me, and the relaxation is far better than any anti-anxiety meds I've ever taken.

[ThirdMan]

Marijuana Maintenance

I figured I'd throw in my two cents. I also live in California and I agree with moglor that, ironically, in many circles I run into people that see pot as a healthy alternative to alcohol. Frankly, I agree with them! I used to smoke pot more when I was in college, and now I have some just sitting around. Since I've been sober from alcohol for the last two months I have smoked it once. In all my years as an occasional pot smoker I have never gotten carried away with it like I have alcohol. I also know people that have even considered themselves "addicted to pot" but once they got over it they continued to drink socially and without any problems.

I guess my point is that I'm happy to have an alternative to AA where people can discuss these options without the dreaded stigma. For me I will probably not smoke pot, and certainly not often, but mostly just because I don't like it that much. If it provides an alternative to drinking for some, and it doesn't interfere with your life the way alcohol has, it's hard to contest that it's an upgrade. After all, the objective here is to live productive, non-destructive, fulfilling lives. Being the personification of saintly perfection to me is not a requirement for success.

[tm1210]

Marijuana Maintenance

I say give it a go. Cannabis shouldn't do you no harm. I smoked it for many years but stopped because of anxiety brought on by something else.

[Marshy]

Marijuana Maintenance

Greg,

I just wanted to point out (I'm sure you know) that there are health risks from cannabis - to your lungs and heart if you're smoking, and also to mental health.

I used to smoke cannabis and around the time I stopped was when skunk was entering the market in a big way (about 15 years ago). If you're using skunk you'll know how much more powerful it is than the old stuff and therefore has more risks.

I'm not anti-cannabis (I used to enjoy it but it was something I could take or leave and I moved on from the group of friends I used to smoke it with which is why I stopped. Oh, and the booze became all-important, of course).

Here's an article about effects of regular use:

What is the long-term effect of cannabis? | Life and style | The Observer

What is the long-term effect of cannabis?

For about 10 years I smoked cannabis regularly if not excessively. In the evenings I'd get home from work and have a joint to unwind, and I smoked about the same amount at weekends. I used it to help me relax and sleep better. About five years ago I stopped doing it - I just got out of the habit. Now I keep reading about the effect that strong grass like skunk can have on mental health and all the reports have got me worried about the long-term health implications of dope. I'm a 39-year-old woman and recently have had quite unpleasant bouts of anxiety and insomnia - might this be caused by my smoking? Can you have a delayed reaction, and are there any other long-term effects?

[b]The psychiatrist: Robin Murray:
The risk of smoking cannabis is a bit similar to that of drinking alcohol. Most people who drink alcohol, and most people who smoke cannabis, don't come to any harm. However, just as drinking a bottle of whisky a day is more of a hazard to your health than drinking a pint of lager, so skunk is more hazardous than traditional forms of cannabis, such as herb or resin, because it may contain three times as much of the active ingredient tetrahydrocannabinol (THC).

The adverse effects of cannabis use are different to those you describe. They usually start with either memory difficulties or paranoid and suspicious ideas, and can progress to psychotic symptoms such as hallucinations and delusions. These symptoms usually come on while the individual is still smoking, and there is no good evidence that smoking cannabis can cause either anxiety or insomnia.

? Professor Robin Murray works at the Institute of Psychiatry

The nurse: Chris Hudson:[/B
]It's unlikely that there's a direct link between your concerns and your history of smoking cannabis. While some insomnia and anxiety may be a common experience for those who have recently given up using the drug, there's little evidence to suggest these symptoms continue after the body has eliminated it from the system - which is between four to six weeks in the case of cannabis. Your complaints could be caused by stress, side-effects from prescription drugs, alcohol use or exposure to allergens.

Recent reports on the damage to lungs caused by smoking cannabis - that one joint can be equal to five cigarettes - are probably true, though it's not helpful to get hung up on numbers. The good news is that even after five years, your lungs and other organs have made much progress in repairing damaged tissue. Your GP will be able to recommend strategies for managing the anxiety and insomnia.

? Chris Hudson is a nurse and operations manager at Respond, the drug treatment centre

The consultant: Dr Ken Checinski:
Evidence suggests a delayed reaction is unlikely. However, cannabis - especially skunk - can lead to acute and severe psychotic episodes (including believing strange, often fearful things and seeing or hearing things that aren't there), or trigger an underlying vulnerability to mental illness, most typically in cases of schizophrenia.

When long-term users stop taking a drug, it's quite common to replace it with something else. Are you substituting cannabis with alcohol or other drugs? Substances like these may mask underlying problems such as depression or anxiety.

Your symptoms may be a response to everyday stresses and are likely to get better on their own or respond to psychological treatments available through your GP. Don't self-medicate and resist any temptation to start using cannabis again in order to relax.

For more information, visit the mental illness charity Rethink at Rethink, for everyone affected by schizophrenia, bipolar disorder and other mental illnesses | Rethink, The Leading Severe Mental Illness Charity

? Dr Ken Checinski is a senior consultant in addictive behaviour

[anne1232]

Marijuana Maintenance

just another idea

Anti-anxiety: atenolol, Tenormin

I live in Los Angles and know a lot of performers...this is what they take for stage fright, or the "fight or flight" rush we interpret as anxiety, or social anxiety, which leads to cravings.
A tiny amount, only when needed, will obliterate those sensations. I think this is a petty benign, and 'non-highing' way of reining in these physical feelings. Tenormin is very cheap, unlike Bac or Vicodin for that matter. Both Bac and Vic even in small doses for anxiety sometimes 'relax' me (get me high) to the point that I think...why not have just one drink, which is the most dangerous place for my head to be in. I'm thrilled large doses of Bac work for so many, I just can't afford it. And I get too high off it, frankly. Please don't attack me, Bac people. Just another opinion.
Re: pot- sometimes I use it...but I COOK it in a bit of butter, fry it on low heat for 10 minutes, put it on a cracker or bread. It then very slowly enters the system, and you are unaware of a high, just gradually you feel more relaxed. My doctor told me this, and said it is abs. the safest way to deal w/ anxiety, the second being the tenormin. The goal is to eliminate the anxiety without a high.