Me and Bac

[bleep]

Me and Bac

Jeepers, here we go again! (I thought "jeepers" went very well with "good heavens", used earlier. I'm despairing about the whole exercise though, and think I am best served by a simple "Fuck!" Thoughts?)

ftr, I think Ig has a point. There is no doubt the SE's are very real and very debilitating. There is also no doubt in my mind that a massive focus of attention on them will make some of them a little worse than they really are, for some posters. Still, what is, is, and nothing is going to change, so I think a massive derail of poor Z's thread would be a bummer.

Ne and Z rhyming? Took me ages to figure out, I pronounce Z as zed, so I thought it was some strange pronunciation of Ne that I was missing!

Zephra, you'll find that most doctors will just be ignorant when it comes to SE's of high dose baclofen, and not through any fault of their own. There just isn't information on it, it is a new idea, and the most knowledge I have ever found about it is right here. You will know more than just about any doctor. Even doctors that are aware of its existence seem to have a curious blind spot when it comes to SE's.

[beatle]

Me and Bac

I didn't think it was derailing the thread, as it is focussed on SEs, which is the theme of the thread.

I also felt that I raised some valid points about SEs which are very pertinent to Zeph's inquiry, that could be useful to others who might not have followed earlier threads, although I think it got mired in a little too much tit-for-tat (which I tried to mitigate in my response to Ig's response, but obviously failed there.)

I thought I made it clear that we just differ and we respect each other, and so his response was also valid (even if a tad vitriolic in response to my appeasing post -- at least that's what I thought was, i can see in retrospect that some of my comments could have been taken in a different way than intended), and Ig's points, though I disagree with the essence of what he is implying, are valid and perhaps of interest to other readers, including Zeph. (Sorry about the personal tone it took, though, and hope it didn't put other readers off. I think my first post was very very valid, though, and I regret that it upset Ig, but I hope it helps Zeph. Nuff said. Back to Zeph and SEs.

[Guest]

Me and Bac

I actually understood what Ig meant in his psychosomatic post and it certainly did not mean made up, in the mind or mentally created at all. It meant quite real, genuine SEs.

[beatle]

Me and Bac

Ukblonde;1120095 wrote: I actually understood what Ig meant in his psychosomatic post and it certainly did not mean made up, in the mind or mentally created at all. It meant quite real, genuine SEs.

Yes REAL, not made up, but based on mental/emotional origins (read the definition provided in my post from a medical dictionary).

I think you, UK, of all people, would understand and agree that your physical SEs were not based on mental/emotional preconceptions on how bac would work or on others' reports of SEs. You, in fact, were taken by surprise by the SEs, so they clearly were not psychosomatic (i.e. caused by underlying mental beliefs/presuppositions)

This is my one and only point of dissention with the implication that SEs are psychosomatic. Psychosomatic does mean REAL physical symptoms (NOBODY is questioning this point, so I don't know why we keep coming back to it:upset, but it means by definition, and certainly by the association attributed to it, that the physical symptoms are based on mental/emotional factors and expectations. I think this is flat out wrong about baclofen in many cases, although not all -- I'm sure expectations of certain SEs will make real physical symptoms appear or feel worse, and I'm sure many have experienced SEs physically worse than they would have if not for the psychosomatic element -- which is a true and proven phenomenon in science, and VERY relevant here, as well, so I have NO problem with bringing it up as a possible factor, I just have a BIG problem with implying it as any kind of explanation for the majority of the SEs here, and a BIG problem with the kind of demotivation and stigma it puts on the many people with these very real symptoms that are NOT psychosomatic, and the effect such an implication will have on them. Wow... that was lengthy -- hope it clears things up. But probably not.uch:

[Ne/Neva Eva]

Me and Bac

A thought occurred to me, Z. Eschew docs all you want, I get it for sure. But we live A LOT longer than we did 100 years ago (as in double) and I credit hand washing and modern medicine. In that order. lol.

You should see a doctor every now and then just to check in on the insides. They have unique tools for that.
xo

[bleep]

Me and Bac

Modern medicine certainly has a lot to do with it. A health system that can deliver is another. We have backslid a little in my part of the world, and our life expectancy here is a paltry 36 years these days! In a few short years I will be increasing the national average! I think it is now the lowest in the world