Need to talk to other people treating their addiction with Baclofen

[Lostinspace]

Stevo - I’m sorry you had such a bad night on Friday and are now toying with the idea of drinking more just because it’s there. As you know, I never reached a switch dose, so I can’t speak from experience there. But I’m not surprised that you had that happen. I’ve found that old habits sometimes speak louder than cravings. That’s why I personally can’t have any more in the house than I plan on drinking on any given night. Even though I’m no longer craving, and don’t even really want more, if it’s there, it’ll get finished.

It’s possible that you’re not actually at your true switch dose. But I’m also not sure that going up further in dose is really the answer, since you had been doing so well at the dose you’re already on, and had mostly positive experiences with drinking the few times that you have so far.

I would just advise you to be careful and not overdo it - as in not drinking too often. A lot of people have found that drinking too often can temporarily undo the benefits of indifference. It’s not that they were back to square one by any means, more that they started drinking out of habit and found their cravings returning. The good news is that indifference can be fairly quickly restored after another period of abstinence.

Try not to worry too much about what’s gone on this weekend. Use it as a learning experience and try to figure out what possibly went wrong, and what you can do differently in the future. Maybe it’s just a matter of not keeping alcohol at home, and leaving your drinking as a social thing for when you get together with friends.

[kronkcarr]

Hey Steveo,

Your post is a good one--new baclofen users could get an understanding of how it could go and I, as a longer user, get a reminder. I suggest going up a bit on bac and see what that does. Unless you want to continue along as you're going.

You made a comment that interested me: "...all the trimmings of the things that I'd felt I'd missed out on for the previous 2 years." I know in my first year on baclofen I wanted to drink and have fun on my birthday. I thought of it a few months ahead--very similar to your statement. I can't remember what I did on my birthday but I didn't get drunk. I quit over drinking because I didn't like most of my behavior when I was drunk. I did miss being the life of the party and after my first year or so on bac I had no clue who I was. Now I just am.

You mention your killer hangover and that uncomfortable feeling. I know and hate that feeling. I'm happy that I've realized that I get to pick if I want that feeling or not. Basically for me I'm dull and unmotivated for the first 9 hours of the next day and it's not worth it to me.

I'm doing my taxes and looking at all my receipts. I can see the times when I wasted money on wine. I remember my first year on bac when I was thrilled at the money I saved by not habitually or mindlessly drinking at home. So it's not like I'm vigilent, but I'd rather spend my money differently, and, like you, I hate that uncomfortable feeling.

[Spiritfree]

Stevo -thank you for a great and honest post. Please feel free to send me hate posts and whatever else might help after reading what I am about to write. Please understand that I am writing from a point of my own experience and the experiences that I have witnessed in others -for many years now (25+).

Most of what you read here about finally having a choice to drink or not to drink once you reach this so called miracle switch point is crap -pure and simple. Perhaps if you were one that that drank some wine at night and regretted doing so the next, baclofen may have helped you more quickly decide not drink and talk on the phone, etc. However, if you have been drinking heavily for some time -or even use to, your brain will eventually require you to keep chasing the prior memorized feelings/thoughts that alcohol use bring -Baclofen or not. I know this from personal experience and from the other experiences that I have read.

We read about how others manage to control their drinking -minimizing what is immediately available to them, only drinking on xyz days, etc. The fact remains -for them and all of the rest of us, alcohol eventually has to become a non choice. Some of us cry and moan and feel sorry for ourselves that we can not drink because of xyz. But this is fact. A person can outdrink their baclofen. Bottom line: The brain wants to change the way that it feels or thinks sometimes and alcohol is the easiest, least expensive way of doing so.

We all have a million reasons to drink. Our brains are so ingrained with the 'positive' sides of drinking that most times it is very difficult to overcome the illusion until we have once again drank.

Steve, I want to assure you of one thing -or at least one thing that has been my experience. Once you make the decision to stay away from the firewater, and do so with a helping hand from Baclofen, you will never regret the decision. Just don't keep fooling yourself and allowing others to sway you into thinking otherwise. Drop the alcohol, take your Baclofen, and enjoy your new life.

All of my rhetoric is only an opinion -of course.

[MeJustMe]

Hi Steveo,

I'm sorry you've had a tough night on AL - but good on you for getting it out there (as in posting about it here).

This is the big difference between here and 'recovery' that I have found - we're not into 'abstain or be shunned'.

I have had AL the last couple of nights, but barely enough to fit in a shot glass (like how I use a booze glass as my standard of measurement ) because I know that the Antibuse will soon kick in and it will be a horrible feeling.

Even with this small amount of AL in my system I could feel my face begin to flush, the first reaction to having AL and Antibuse. I know all about the dangers of using AL while on Antibuse - I once had about six drinks on it and thought I would die. It is a very strong disincentive to drink.

However the point is that I still have not got over the cravings - but then I am still tritrating up on the Bac. My wife still drinks and having people drink AL around me is, from time to time, incredibly difficult.

I think it is great you had such a long break from AL, and I wonder if that might be the way forward? I don't know - these are just questions I ask myself. I wonder if I just quit on planning drinks, monitoring drinks and simply cut AL out altogether if in the long run it would be easier. Not easy (for me so far anyway), just easier...

[neophyte]

I think most alcoholics can relate when they play games of logic to justify their drinking. I still do it, I often get cravings when im on the train back home from wrok. Once im home they go away but sometimes I cave, buy a bottle of wine and of course regret it the next morning. This is where antabuse comes in, I take 250mg on sundays and any passing thought of having a drink isn't an issue throughout the week.

I don't do long stretches of sobriety though, i tend to just keep my drinking when im doign something social, my friends are big drinkers so its tough not to. Alcohol doesnt have teh same kick on baclofen, but it still has some minor euphoria / relaxation. Some people on here say they get no euphoria what so ever from drinking, so perhaps I need to just take more baclofen. That said im on 250mg and 1-2 drinking nights during the month is ok for me.

Sounds like antabuse could help, just be careful drinking on it.

[Stevo]

I just wrote a whole heap of stuff and it vanished.
So I will try to give you all the abridged version.
I don't really feel like the outcome of drinking too much on the weekend was a negative thing in any way.I have learned a lot from this.I believe that it has served a purpose and I have walked away from it with an even greater knowledge of where I stand.I at this stage will not be upping my daily dose of Baclofen,but am aware that if this type of behaviour continues that I always can.I needed to have a night where things went further than I thought that they could to gain a better understanding of where I stand concerning AL and the positive aspects of Baclofen.I now know very tangibly that sometimes even with Baclofen the stop button can be easily ignored and I can very easily drink myself into oblivion.
It is not that I don't want to wake up with a hangover anymore,it is also that I don't really get the enjoyment out of drinking that I once had.
I am grateful for the experience.I would have been left wondering for God knows how long if I hadn't gone ahead and done the initial experiment and then continued it over the next 3 weekends.
I am still leaning towards believing that the switch has been hit,yet I must be ever vigilent.
It is very late here as I write this and I am almost falling asleep as I type.
Thankyou LIS and Kronkcarrfor your encouragement.

Spiritfree there will be no hate filled posts aimed at you and I see a great deal of value in the words that you wrote.Although I will be having a few on social occasions,your approach to recovery with Baclofen is something that can not be disregarded.

MeJustMe I had written so much in response to what you have written and just cant do it again now I am so tired,but I can relate to what you say about being shunned.I had a conversation with someone at the wedding about just this on the Saturday afternoon.Complete abstinence for me is not really an option at this point in my life.
Maybe one day I will get a chance to communicate with you about these things.

I can relate to a lot of what you said aswell Neophyte but just cant elaborate right now.

Everything that everyone has said makes sense and I can relate to.

I am so wishing right now that the first post didn't disappear but am sure over time that everything will be said and/or covered in other posts.
Thanks so much guys,now I must sleep.
Cheers Stevo.

[LibraryGirl]

Is Baclofen for me?

I find the idea of being indifferent to alcohol, or only drinking a small amount every blue moon (indifference!) to be fascinating and I covet it. It seems like a miracle, but I'm not sure I'm ready to talk with a doctor about treatment, nor if any doctor could be found in my area (eastern U.S.) that would prescribe it. I won't ask any questions about dosage or addiction, because I'm sure that's been covered ad nauseum, but could I ask if there's a way to get baclofen without a prescription and what kind of cost are associated?

[Spiritfree]

I find the idea of being indifferent to alcohol, or only drinking a small amount every blue moon (indifference!) to be fascinating and I covet it. It seems like a miracle, but I'm not sure I'm ready to talk with a doctor about treatment, nor if any doctor could be found in my area (eastern U.S.) that would prescribe it. I won't ask any questions about dosage or addiction, because I'm sure that's been covered ad nauseum, but could I ask if there's a way to get baclofen without a prescription and what kind of cost are associated?

Hi LG -If I am not mistaken, there are a few of the more notable online pharmacies that offer a form of counseling and then issue are able to sell you the Baclofen.

[Lostinspace]

Hi LibraryGirl. Welcome to the forum!! There are most certainly places where you can order. But before we get to that, check out the prescribing guide: http://www.scribd.com/doc/105506724/...Version#scribd

I would also advise you to read up as much as you can from this site, especially going back into the archives a few years, when this site was a lot more active.

I can only speak for one pharmacy - River Pharmacy - it’s advertised on this site. That’s the only place I’ve ever ordered from, so I can’t say anything about other pharmacies. You have to finish your order with them by phone, but it’s not too weird. Don’t worry. They’re very kind, and you just place your order and are done with it, much as you would be if you were placing an order for a gift for someone. It’s no big deal. But definitely read up, and make sure you know what you’re getting into first. Good luck to you! And keep us posted if you decide to try it.

[LibraryGirl]

I know there are various schools of thought on it (baclofen), and withdrawal seems to be an issue if one wishes to stop taking the med. I understand that it's similar to an antidepressant, which I also take, and would have much the same withdrawal symptoms. I have read in the past on here about people overdosing and the scare it caused. I guess I should do some research...is it one of those things that sounds too good to be true?

[neophyte]

I know there are various schools of thought on it (baclofen), and withdrawal seems to be an issue if one wishes to stop taking the med. I understand that it's similar to an antidepressant, which I also take, and would have much the same withdrawal symptoms. I have read in the past on here about people overdosing and the scare it caused. I guess I should do some research...is it one of those things that sounds too good to be true?

The withdrawal is much worse than an anti depressant if the withdrawal is abrupt i.e. cold turkey. If you start taking baclofen you need to ensure you have adequate supplies to taper off slowly e.g. 20mg off every 5 days. Abrupt withdrawal can give similar symptoms to abrupt withdrawal of benzos.

but yes baclofen works, lots of members here using it successfully to stop drinking daily including myself.

[Stevo]

G'day guys,
I just wanted to post a quick update to the thread about how I am going with the seemingly ongoing drinking experiment.

I have drank every weekend since the night when I went overboard and have been able to stop or more truthfully get to a point where I just don't want to drink anymore.
It is not a struggle to tip out the last beer and I don't obsess or crave drinking anymore once I have decided to stop.
I am finding that each night that I drink is different,one night I had 2 beers and didn't want anymore another I had 6 and then didn't want anymore.Last Sunday was my 40th birthday and an old drinking buddy came over to see me,I was well and truly prepared to have a blinder of a day but at around 8 beers I once again found that I had had quite enough.
I have had AL in my house constantly throughout the duration of the ongoing experiment and find that during the week I am not interested at all.
I have realised that I still enjoy having a beer and I enjoy the social aspect very much yet have lost the need to write myself off or drink until I pass out.
I have had people say to me that they wouldn't want to only drink a few and they never drank like that anyway,therefore they see no point in just having a few.I used to think like this too,but now I have a completely different mindset and it is awesome to be able to drink a few without it turning into a wasted event.
I am finding that the uncomfortable feeling the next day is still there and it is definitely serving as a deterent but only because it is not a nice place to be.My drinking has not been changed because I don't like this feeling,it is because of the Baclofen I am sure.

I cant think of too much else to add to this post except that it seems to me that the big night that I had a couple of weeks ago was an anomaly and although I am now aware that this can happen I don't have to worry about it becoming the norm.
I am aware that abstinence is the way to go for some people even with Baclofen and after that night even thought that it was going to be the way for me aswell,maybe not now though.

It is still early days and I will continue to post any changes and updates in the hope that my experience may someday be able to help others.
Cheers Stevo.

[terryk]

Bump

[Stevo]

Quick update on the ongoing drinking experiment.

I had a fairly big drinking night a couple of nights ago,there was definitely a point where my brain said right about now would be a good time to stop and if I chose to I could have done it easily.I chose to ignore this and drank on anyway.There was no dramas or issues throughout the evening and I didn't wake up thinking OMG what have I done.I knew that I could have stopped yet consciously decided that I wanted to get plastered.I now have this choice.
This did not cause me to have to continue my drinking through the next day and although I did drink the next night I consumed much less and when I felt it was time to stop that is just what I did.
I have continued through today being Sunday here in Australia with no thoughts of wanting or needing a drink.I will most likely not have another drink until next weekend.

As far as I am concerned the experiment is well and truly over,I am now thanks to Baclofen completely indifferent to AL.I have the ability and choice to say yes I would like to have a drink or no I don't feel like it tonight.
This is a concept that until I spoke to other people who have reached indifference I had never thought conceivable.A freedom once unimaginable to those in recovery.
I have almost completely broken free of the conditioning of the 12 step fellowships which once dominated my concepts of recovery from alcoholism and drug addiction.I say almost because the indoctrination which I exposed myself to had rooted itself firmly,but thanks to the encouragement and advice of people on this forum(you know who you are)I have been able to begin to fully grasp the freedom that Baclofen offers.
I have battled alcohol for 30 years and thanks to Baclofen I no longer need to be afraid that I am on the losing side.
All I have to offer is my experience in the hope that maybe one day someone might read my posts and say to themselves"I too would like what Stevo has described."If this is what comes to mind as you are reading I would like to encourage you to give Baclofen a try.

I most definitely am not trying to encourage people to drink.This is just how it is working for me.

Not too sure if I will be posting anymore updates as I don't feel that I am conducting any sort of experiment anymore.This was never meant to be something of scientific value and could not be anyway.
All the reports,studies and scientific facts are great to help further the cause for Baclofen to become easier to access for the suffering alcoholic,not to mention that they are very interesting,but at the end of the day I like most people who have suffered alcoholism only really cared about whether this could work for me,and for me it has.

Dr.Amiessen truly heralded a new age with the experiment that he so courageously conducted on himself offering a new light on the dark world of alcoholism.

Cheers Stevo.

[Stevo]

I thought I would bump my old thread for any of the newcomers that might be interested in knowing a little more about my journey.

As I said to Mentium the other day my goals and experiences may not be the same as others but I think that those who are wondering about where I am coming from may get some answers from this.

Cheers Stevo.