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On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

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    #16
    On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

    TYPE 8

    TYPE 8
    Taking charge, because they don't want to be controlled


    People of this personality type are essentially unwilling to be controlled, either by others or by their circumstances; they fully intend to be masters of their fate. Eights are strong willed, decisive, practical, tough minded and energetic. They also tend to be domineering; their unwillingness to be controlled by others frequently manifests in the need to control others instead. When healthy, this tendency is kept under check, but the tendency is always there, nevertheless, and can assume a central role in the Eight's interpersonal relationships.

    Eights generally have powerful instincts and strong physical appetites which they indulge without feelings of shame or guilt. They want a lot out of life and feel fully prepared to go out and get it. They need to be financially independent and often have a hard time working for anyone. This sometimes necessitates that the Eight opt out of the system entirely, assuming something of an outlaw mentality. Most Eights however, find a way to be financially independent while making their peace with society, but they always retain an uneasy association with any hierarchical relationship that sees the Eight in any position other than the top position.

    Eights have a hard time lowering their defenses in intimate relationships. Intimacy involves emotional vulnerability and such vulnerability is one of the Eight's deepest fears. Betrayal of any sort is absolutely intolerable and can provoke a powerful response on the part of the violated Eight. Intimate relationships are frequently the arena in which an Eight's control issues are most obviously played out and questions of trust assume a pivotal position. Eights often have a sentimental side that they don't even show to their intimates, such is their fear of vulnerability. But, while trust does not come easily to an Eight, when an Eight does take someone into the inner sanctum, they find a steadfast ally and stalwart friend. The Eight's powerful protective instincts are called into play when it comes to the defense of family and friends, and Eights are frequently generous to a fault in providing for those under their care.

    Eights are prone to anger. When severely provoked, or when the personality is unbalanced, bouts of anger can turn into rages. Unhealthy Eights are frankly agressive and when pushed, can resort to violence. Such Eights enjoy intimidating others whom they see as "weak" and feel little compunction about walking over anyone who stands in their way. They can be crude, brutal and dangerous.

    Female Eights are far more likely to mistype than male Eights, as many of the traits typical to the type Eight personality have been discouraged in females. For the most part, however, it is other types who mistake themselves for Eights. This is especially common in male counterphobic Sixes who fail to recognize that their agression is a cover for a very deep seated anxiety. Sevens too, are prone to mistype as Eights, but Sevens lack the intensity of focus typical of the type Eight, and while both Sevens and Eights have high energy personalities, Eights have a physically based energy whereas the Seven's energetic pattern has a nervous, mental quality to it.

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      #17
      On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

      TYPE 9

      TYPE 9
      Keeping peace and harmony


      People of this personality type essentially feel a need for peace and harmony. They tend to avoid conflict at all costs, whether it be internal or interpersonal. As the potential for conflict in life is virtually ubiquitous, the Nine's desire to avoid it generally results in some degree of withdrawal from life, and many Nines are, in fact, introverted. Other Nines lead more active, social lives, but nevertheless remain to some to degree "checked out," or not fully involved, as if to insulate themselves from threats to their peace of mind. Most Nines are fairly easy going; they adopt a strategy of "going with the flow." They are generally reliable, sturdy, self-effacing, tolerant and likable individuals.

      Nines tend to adopt an optimistic approach to life; they are, for the most part, trusting people who see the best in others; they frequently have a deep seated faith that things will somehow work out. They desire to feel connected, both to other people and to the world at large. They frequently feel most at home in nature and generally make warm and attentive parents.

      The Nine's inability to tolerate conflict sometimes translates into an overall conservative approach to change. Change can provoke unpleasant feelings and disrupt the Nine's desire for comfort. Less healthy Nines seem incapable of motivating themselves to move into action and bring about effective change. When change does come however, as it generally will, Nines find that they are usually well able to adapt. They tend to be more resilient than they give themselves credit for. In fact, Nines tend not to give themselves enough credit in general, and their self-effacing attitude often seems to invite others to take them for granted or to overlook their often significant contributions. This can cause a subterranean anger to build inside the Nine's psyche, which can erupt into consciousness in occasional fits of temper which quickly blow over, but which more often manifests itself in passive agressive footdragging. Being overlooked is often a source of a deep sadness in Nines, a sadness that they scarcely ever give voice to.

      Nines frequently mistype themselves as they have a rather diffuse sense of their own identities. This is exacerbated by the fact that Nines often merge with their loved ones and through a process of identification take on the characteristics of those closest to them. Female Nines frequently mistype as Twos, especially if they are the mothers are small children. Nines, however, are self-effacing whereas Twos are quite aware of their own self worth. Nines also mistake themselves for Fours, but Nines tend to avoid negative emotions whereas Fours often exacerbate them. Intellectual Nines, especially males, frequently mistype as Fives, but Fives are intellectually contentious whereas Nines are conciliatory and conflict avoidant.

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        #18
        On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

        I am "most likely" a 9 but it is not clear.

        42 is the answer to the question in "A Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy"

        Of course, they forgot what the question was.

        Cindi
        AF April 9, 2016

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          #19
          On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

          Hey Cinders,
          If Nine is not a sure bet, then that could mean you are a Two... have kids?
          Cheers. Z

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            #20
            On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

            There is also a personal growth aspect to this - as you are supposed to work toward a certain type to attain...something. Like Fours are supposed to go to One for integration, but for a Four to go to a Two, that is disintegration. I just know the Four stuff. And how you become your type is at least partly to do with your relationship with your parents - positively identified with mom, or dad, or negatively. Fours are negatively identified with both parents, which turns them inward, looking for whatever is missing or defective. Tragic!!!

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              #21
              On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

              You are far from tragic Lila. I know you have had a hard life. I see you as an angel, an angel with a broken wing sure... but an angel nonetheless.

              We are all flawed, each and every one of us. and that's what makes us beautiful.

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                #22
                On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                oh thanks Zed! Yes we all are. We all have our stories and stuff that shape us, you know.
                Lila

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                  #23
                  On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                  I am a 9....
                  Living now and not just existing since 9th July 2008
                  Nicotine Free since 6th February 2009

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                    #24
                    On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                    Since I'm a psychologist, I have looked for research that might support the Enneagram personality typology and/or the reliability or validity of the tests that measure the various "types." There really isn't any. However, many psychologists and counselors use the Enneagram in their work and find it helpful. In that way, it is a lot like the Myers-Briggs... it is popular, and intuitively makes sense, but not considered scientifically reliable or valid.

                    That being said, I am clearly one of those dreadful 8's. I know that the types are supposed to be "value-neutral," but I don't like having myself so clearly pegged as being so dominating and appetitive! Sounds like Attila the Hun. Of course, ideally, I think I am supposed to be a good, well-integrated 8, and I suppose I do pretty well at that. I haven't conquered any small villages lately, have done no pillaging or looting...

                    I know that many people who are Christian work with the Enneagram, and are very interested in the personal growth aspects of the system. One of the primary developers is a former Jesuit priest, and many of the Catholic sisters I know are very into this stuff. But I have never been able to figure out exactly HOW one is supposed to "work toward integration." I've read the books, but they all seem very vague, to me. There's all kind of stuff about the other types being "wings" and so forth. It's very complicated and I don't find it user-friendly! Also, I suspect that personality characteristics (such as those described in the Enneagram system) have a stronger genetic than an environmental component.

                    wip

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                      #25
                      On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                      Hi wip
                      Maybe it helps because it makes one aware of one's tendencies. Like catching oneself in an unhealthy thought and saying Oh, that's just my Four, or whatever number, defense mechanism, and also being aware of what you look like, I mean behave and think like when you get unhealthy. But yes, there is no path of integration. I bought a cheesy book a long time ago by Donald Riso - Enneagram Transformations, and it had affirmations. I loved his main book on enneagrams and found it helpful, but I just thought his affirmation book was kind of a shallow bit of pop self-help.
                      What systems do you find most useful for personal growth?
                      Lila

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                        #26
                        On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                        Hey A-w-i-p! Agreed. I'm personally of the conviction that all creatures on this earth are more complex than any system or chart can encompass. Humans especially, although I have known some unpredictable cats and elephants too, in this lifetime!

                        Heaven knows I have bits of every type in me, depending on the day, the hour, the company or lack thereof, the music and the weather.

                        Attila the Hun gets a bad rap, you know. A vastly misunderstood personality in world history. I hear that he was a caring gent, but yes sure, with territorial and anger management issues.

                        In his later days he learnt how to knit and paint crockery, and he spent this waning years playing with children and he founded the Hun Institute of Shared Values for a Better and More Progressive 5th Century.

                        lol.

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                          #27
                          On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                          I also like it because the state of being healthy may be different for different people.

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                            #28
                            On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                            zed;469000 wrote:
                            Attila the Hun gets a bad rap, you know. A vastly misunderstood personality in world history. I hear that he was a caring gent, but yes sure, with territorial and anger management issues.

                            In his later days he learnt how to knit and paint crockery, and he spent this waning years playing with children and he founded the Hun Institute of Shared Values for a Better and More Progressive 5th Century.

                            lol.
                            HA! Very good, Zed! Knitting, that should do the trick!

                            Lila, Riso is the guy I was talking about; he was a Jesuit priest. Very odd personal twist to the story about Riso is that when I was in college, I dated his brother, who had been adopted into another family and only found his Riso family when he was in his 40's; and thereafter he changed his own name to "Riso"!

                            And I agree with you that being aware of our own personality "types" and tendencies is a hugely important step in the direction of wisely choosing our behaviors, and looking at problems we might be having in relationships... and in life, in general.

                            My own thoughts about how to move toward a better, healthier, more mature emotional and spiritual life are closely aligned with the teachings of the Buddha. Many ideas in Buddhist thought and psychology are very compatible with modern, Western, psychology. The self-help book I have found that best integrates contemporary, scientifically sound ideas about psychotherapy with Buddhist teachings is called Emotional Alchemy. The author is well versed in what is called "schema therapy" and also in the use of meditation, and mindfulness, to help us become less reactive, and more creative and compassionate. "Schemas" are similar to personality types, in many ways....

                            wip

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                              #29
                              On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                              Thanks wip, I will look that up on Amazon. That is interesting, about the brother! I did prefer Riso's book to Helen Palmer's, I just felt I wasted my money on the affirmation one.
                              Yes, zed, we are complex beings! That's what I always say
                              Lila

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                                #30
                                On Enneagram Types and generally being chuffed!

                                Dear WIP - you and I should talk Buddhism some time. Maybe start a thread somewhere? I don't know much, but being from India, I have an background from my childhood with the subject and then with the practice in more recent years as an adult.

                                Btw, I have visited the Deer Park in Sarnath just outside Varanasi in north India where Gautama gave his first Dharma teaching. I have also been to Lumbini, Gautama's birthplace, on the border region between Nepal and India - just passing through - on a bus into Nepal.

                                I am a life-long student of Zen & Suchness. Anyway, I haven't learnt much at all, if fact it'd be safe to say that I learnt nothing.

                                It's time to drink my coffee before it turns cold!

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